Trailblazers - Nuggets

[Alex English]

^{Portland Trail Blazers trade:}
89 LaMarcus Aldridge - $20,000,000 - $22,200,000 - $24,642,000 - $27,352,620 - $30,361,408 - $33,701,163
88 John Wall - $22,632,000 - $24,668,880 - $26,889,079 - $29,309,096 - $31,946,914 - $35,461,074
81 Luol Deng - $10,117,650 - $11,230,591 - $12,465,956 - $13,837,211
71 Rashad Vaughn - $1,112,900 - $1,163,000 - $1,213,100 - $2,058,631 - $2,995,308
POR 2017 2nd round pick

Total: $53,862,550


^{Denver Nuggets trade:}
88 Paul George - $20,329,914 - $22,566,205 - $25,048,487 - $27,803,821 - $30,862,241 - $34,257,087
87 Kyrie Irving - $9,191,949
82 Ryan Anderson - $9,396,750 - $9,920,393 - $10,501,636
74 Jodie Meeks - $5,000,000 - $5,413,000 - $6,008,430 - $6,669,357

Total: $43,918,613

Works under 125% rule

---

Yes, this is happening. Biggest trade ever, except for that thing where Lebron got traded.

For me this is about winning a championship. I believe this gives me a better constructed squad to win it all. Kyrie, Harden and PG are three amazing players, but their all quite ball dominant and the biggest thing they bring to their teams is scoring. I think if my team existed in real life then Harden and Kyrie would clash, and George would sort of be an odd man out on the wing. 

After this I'll have one pure scorer in Harden who can be the number one option on offense. Next to him is a far more complimentary player in John Wall, who is a more complete point guard than Kyrie and a much better playmaker compared to Kyrie's pure scoring. Then I'll have a crazy post tandem of Aldridge and Lopez, it will be impossible to shut both of them down. Also, despite losing a top 5 perimeter defender in George, this should improve my team defensively. Kyrie, Harden and Anderson can all be weak links defensively, after this the only bad defensive player in my starting lineup will be Harden. I think the end result will be better.

It's very hard to make this deal, especially with Paul George about to get a rating boost to a 92, I've had this core together for years. I don't really want to lose that. I suppose if this deal does get rejected I'll be ok with it. I don't see how this deal should get rejected though, we're both contenders before the trade, and we'll both be contenders after. POR will have like $35 million in cap space which is tons to re-sign Kyrie, as well as another really good player. I also know Paul George is like Brandon Roy's favourite player, so that's probably his big win in this deal.

I accept. Have at it.

[Ian Noble]

Wow! This is one of the biggest trades in D5 history for sure.

Both teams are taking risks by trading their Bird Rights players. Kyrie is expiring and will have to be re-signed without BRs by Portland. John Wall and LMA could opt out and need re-signing without BRs also - I just woke up so I won't calculate it right now but if Denver has no cap space after this trade surely it's an extremely dangerous trade to make, given they would not have Wall and Aldridge's BRs?

I'm definitely willing to accept. Two of the top five teams in the league shaking things up.

[Brandon Roy]

I accept this trade.. since joining the D5 I've been so hard to trade for PG13 but was not able to trade for him not until now at last Alex agreed to trade him.. We envision him as the star that the Blazers want.. Irving will make up the loss of Wall and we plans on resigning him next season.. Ryan Anderson could also fill up LMA, he's no all star but he's a really good player to have at that position and he's having a great career averages this season..

[Brandon Roy]

we have cap space to sign Irving next season and also to sign another star

[Danny Longley]

Reject from me.Holding my vote for now

Have a major issue with Wall in particular being dealt here, because IMO there is no way he in particular opts in.

Unlike Aldridge who has an opt out on 3, which at least gives him a reason to take a pay-cut for a year - Wall's contract has one opt-out, and then he's locked on an old scale contract for 4 more years and of course the Nuggets lose him because they won't have cap for a hundred more years.

I know the Nuggets would still have a shit ton of talent, but there's just way too much value lost here for me.

[Ian Noble]

Mar 19, 2016 8:40:53 GMT Danny Longley said:

Reject from me.

Have a major issue with Wall in particular being dealt here, because IMO there is no way he in particular opts in.

Unlike Aldridge who has an opt out on 3, which at least gives him a reason to take a pay-cut for a year - Wall's contract has one opt-out, and then he's locked on an old scale contract for 4 more years and of course the Nuggets lose him because they won't have cap for a hundred more years.

I know the Nuggets would still have a shit ton of talent, but there's just way too much value lost here for me.

Actually I think Wall might opt-in due to the max contract rules.

Wall has 5 seasons experience, meaning his maximum starting contract this off season, if the cap jumps to $90,000,000, is $22,500,000

If Wall opts-in (Total: $148m):
$24,668,880 - $26,889,079 - $29,309,096 - $31,946,914 - $35,461,074

If Wall opts-out and gets paid max (Total: $140m):
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $27,722,250 - $30,771,698 - $34,156,584

[Kevin Hollis]

It's hard to say what he would do. Offer him a player option in year two he would have 7 years and the math would be close with a 30 percent cap alotment and a rapidly increasing salary cap. It's projected to jump to 108 million in that year.

22,500,000, 32,400,000, 35,964,000, 39,920,040, 44,311,244 = 175,095,284. He would make roughly 27 million more minus the 2 million he loses in year one, so 25 million.

[Ian Noble]

Mar 19, 2016 9:29:03 GMT Ian Noble said:

Mar 19, 2016 8:40:53 GMT Danny Longley said:

Reject from me.

Have a major issue with Wall in particular being dealt here, because IMO there is no way he in particular opts in.

Unlike Aldridge who has an opt out on 3, which at least gives him a reason to take a pay-cut for a year - Wall's contract has one opt-out, and then he's locked on an old scale contract for 4 more years and of course the Nuggets lose him because they won't have cap for a hundred more years.

I know the Nuggets would still have a shit ton of talent, but there's just way too much value lost here for me.

Actually I think Wall might opt-in due to the max contract rules.

Wall has 5 seasons experience, meaning his maximum starting contract this off season, if the cap jumps to $90,000,000, is $22,500,000

If Wall opts-in (Total: $148m):
$24,668,880 - $26,889,079 - $29,309,096 - $31,946,914 - $35,461,074

If Wall opts-out and gets paid max (Total: $140m):
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $27,722,250 - $30,771,698 - $34,156,584

Although if the cap jumps again to $110,000,000 the following year then Wall would earn an absolute ton of money...

[Ian Noble]

Full options available to John Wall:

1. Opt-in
Total: $148m
$24,668,880 - $26,889,079 - $29,309,096 - $31,946,914 - $35,461,074

2. Opt-out, five year max contract under a $90m cap:
Total: $140m
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $27,722,250 - $30,771,698 - $34,156,584

3. Opt-out, sign a two year max contract under a $90m cap, then sign a max contract under a $110m cap as a 7 year veteran earning 30% of the cap instead of 25%:
Total: $158m
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $33,000,000 - $36,630,000 - $40,659,300 - $45,131,823 - $50,096,324

[Kevin Hollis]

Mar 19, 2016 10:10:10 GMT Ian Noble said:

Full options available to John Wall:

1. Opt-in
Total: $148m
$24,668,880 - $26,889,079 - $29,309,096 - $31,946,914 - $35,461,074

2. Opt-out, five year max contract under a $90m cap:
Total: $140m
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $27,722,250 - $30,771,698 - $34,156,584

3. Opt-out, sign a two year max contract under a $90m cap, then sign a max contract under a $110m cap as a 7 year veteran earning 30% of the cap instead of 25%:
Total: $158m
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $33,000,000 - $36,630,000 - $40,659,300 - $45,131,823 - $50,096,324

I think after this year will be his 6th year, not 5th. So, he would need one year and opt out to hit 7.

[Danny Longley]

Mistake on my part, totally assumed that Wall was eligible for the 30%. Holding my vote for now, will look through numbers later.

Kevin is right though, he'll be a 6 year pro after this year.

[Ian Noble]

Mar 19, 2016 10:15:39 GMT Kevin Hollis said:

Mar 19, 2016 10:10:10 GMT Ian Noble said:

Full options available to John Wall:

1. Opt-in
Total: $148m
$24,668,880 - $26,889,079 - $29,309,096 - $31,946,914 - $35,461,074

2. Opt-out, five year max contract under a $90m cap:
Total: $140m
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $27,722,250 - $30,771,698 - $34,156,584

3. Opt-out, sign a two year max contract under a $90m cap, then sign a max contract under a $110m cap as a 7 year veteran earning 30% of the cap instead of 25%:
Total: $158m
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $33,000,000 - $36,630,000 - $40,659,300 - $45,131,823 - $50,096,324

I think after this year will be his 6th year, not 5th. So, he would need one year and opt out to hit 7.

That's the same as my figures. In Option 3, Wall waits 2 years then re-signs as a 7 year veteran.

6 year veterans still earn max 25%

[Jeremiah Hill]

Mar 19, 2016 10:10:10 GMT Ian Noble said:

Full options available to John Wall:

1. Opt-in
Total: $148m
$24,668,880 - $26,889,079 - $29,309,096 - $31,946,914 - $35,461,074

2. Opt-out, five year max contract under a $90m cap:
Total: $140m
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $27,722,250 - $30,771,698 - $34,156,584

3. Opt-out, sign a two year max contract under a $90m cap, then sign a max contract under a $110m cap as a 7 year veteran earning 30% of the cap instead of 25%:
Total: $158m
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $33,000,000 - $36,630,000 - $40,659,300 - $45,131,823 - $50,096,324

I thought we weren't doing that stupid player option bullshit again.

[JR Wiles]

Stop assumimg the cap will do anything. You guys let this trade go through and Wall leaves then what. Just because the cap is going up does not mean it will continue to go up. Portland gives up the most here to get George who it looks is back to his old self. Irving and Wall are an even call except for Walls salary of course. Deng and Anderson is about equal as long as health isnt a factor. Im not sure who wins or who will get or be better with this deal. I think Denver wins short term. This is a fair trade and i would accept. I just hope these guys just didnt screw their playoff dreams. They were both in it. Denver had to get better to be a contender which he does. Only reason this trade is made. Portland does not get better in my opinion. I hope the teams chemistry will work out. Teams are trading because of GS getting Lebron. Thanks to Miami and its stupid move. Miami might not get in the east. Cant wait until this passes and to see the outcome.

Go Spurs!!

[Ian Noble]

Mar 19, 2016 12:48:11 GMT Jeremiah Hill said:

Mar 19, 2016 10:10:10 GMT Ian Noble said:

Full options available to John Wall:

1. Opt-in
Total: $148m
$24,668,880 - $26,889,079 - $29,309,096 - $31,946,914 - $35,461,074

2. Opt-out, five year max contract under a $90m cap:
Total: $140m
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $27,722,250 - $30,771,698 - $34,156,584

3. Opt-out, sign a two year max contract under a $90m cap, then sign a max contract under a $110m cap as a 7 year veteran earning 30% of the cap instead of 25%:
Total: $158m
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $33,000,000 - $36,630,000 - $40,659,300 - $45,131,823 - $50,096,324

I thought we weren't doing that stupid player option bullshit again.

The only thing that changed with regards to POs is that they can only be in the last year of a contract, but I think the consequences of that rule change probably fix what you're worried about here. We wont have any Demarcus Cousins contracts again.

[Jeremiah Hill]

Paul George is worth more than anyone in this trade and I'm pretty sure is going up to a 92 after these next rating changes. Without BRs Kyrie is truly free to go wherever he wants. If Wall declines his option he's totally free to go wherever he wants because Alex can't even resign him. His PA is gonna have to decide that one.

I accept because its about damned time that Alex lose a trade.

[Jeremiah Hill]

Mar 19, 2016 12:52:01 GMT Ian Noble said:

Mar 19, 2016 12:48:11 GMT Jeremiah Hill said:

I thought we weren't doing that stupid player option bullshit again.

The only thing that changed with regards to POs is that they can only be in the last year of a contract, but I think the consequences of that rule change probably fix what you're worried about here. We wont have any Demarcus Cousins contracts again.

I think it was more or less proven that players take the longest term max with the most guaranteed money given that only David West took a paycut in real life. 

[Jeremiah Hill]

Also Portland, IDK if you realized but you won't be able to resign Paul George unless you gut your team.

[Kevin Hollis]

Mar 19, 2016 12:06:55 GMT Ian Noble said:

Mar 19, 2016 10:15:39 GMT Kevin Hollis said:

I think after this year will be his 6th year, not 5th. So, he would need one year and opt out to hit 7.

That's the same as my figures. In Option 3, Wall waits 2 years then re-signs as a 7 year veteran.

6 year veterans still earn max 25%

That's not what were saying. We are saying he would only sign a on year deal and he would be at 7 years after next season.

[JR Wiles]

Mar 19, 2016 12:57:51 GMT Jeremiah Hill said:

Mar 19, 2016 12:52:01 GMT Ian Noble said:

The only thing that changed with regards to POs is that they can only be in the last year of a contract, but I think the consequences of that rule change probably fix what you're worried about here. We wont have any Demarcus Cousins contracts again.

I think it was more or less proven that players take the longest term max with the most guaranteed money given that only David West took a paycut in real life. 

Guys have been taking pay cuts for years. Of course we notice West because of SA. He was declining and wasnt going to get paid anyhow. He wanted a ring and he has a shot at it. Of course he picked the worst time with GS dominating.

I know George is a great player and his rating may go up, but hes not better than the guys coming into Denver. 

Alex must think this roster can beat GS. Its a trade to win now. After the trade and the season is what im interested to see how it goes down.



I hope a these west teams screw themselves so that us younger teams get into the mix for years to come. I like the trade better for Denver even though i think long term this trade hurts both squads.

[Brandon Roy]

Mar 19, 2016 12:59:57 GMT Jeremiah Hill said:

Also Portland, IDK if you realized but you won't be able to resign Paul George unless you gut your team.

what do you mean Jeremiah?

[Kevin Hollis]

Explain why LMA wouldn't opt out? Doesn't this essentially mean LMA is gone next year due to his cap?

[Ian Noble]

Mar 19, 2016 12:59:57 GMT Jeremiah Hill said:

Also Portland, IDK if you realized but you won't be able to resign Paul George unless you gut your team.

The Blazers will have $53,445,927 on the books when the off season starts, that's almost $40m in cap space, more than enough to re-sign Kyrie. PG is not expiring.

[Ian Noble]

After this trade Denver will have $116,970,652 on the books for this upcoming off season (not including Wall or LMA's player option amounts). This means that if either John Wall or Lamarcus Aldridge decide to opt out then Denver will essentially lose them, he cannot re-sign them because he doesn't have their Bird Rights.

There's going to have to be a serious amount of deliberation over Player Options this year because there are lots of options available to players and lots of things to consider.

I'm really surprised Alex English that you're willing to take this gamble, but I wont stand in your way if you recognise the dangers and still want to go ahead.

Mar 19, 2016 10:10:10 GMT Ian Noble said:

Full options available to John Wall:

1. Opt-in
Total: $148m
$24,668,880 - $26,889,079 - $29,309,096 - $31,946,914 - $35,461,074

2. Opt-out, five year max contract under a $90m cap:
Total: $140m
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $27,722,250 - $30,771,698 - $34,156,584

3. Opt-out, sign a two year max contract under a $90m cap, then sign a max contract under a $110m cap as a 7 year veteran earning 30% of the cap instead of 25%:
Total: $158m
$22,500,000 - $24,975,000 - $33,000,000 - $36,630,000 - $40,659,300 - $45,131,823 - $50,096,324

[Hanamichi Sakuragi]

Mar 19, 2016 12:49:09 GMT JR Wiles said:

Stop assumimg the cap will do anything. You guys let this trade go through and Wall leaves then what. Just because the cap is going up does not mean it will continue to go up. Portland gives up the most here to get George who it looks is back to his old self. Irving and Wall are an even call except for Walls salary of course. Deng and Anderson is about equal as long as health isnt a factor. Im not sure who wins or who will get or be better with this deal. I think Denver wins short term. This is a fair trade and i would accept. I just hope these guys just didnt screw their playoff dreams. They were both in it. Denver had to get better to be a contender which he does. Only reason this trade is made. Portland does not get better in my opinion. I hope the teams chemistry will work out. Teams are trading because of GS getting Lebron. Thanks to Miami and its stupid move. Miami might not get in the east. Cant wait until this passes and to see the outcome.

Go Spurs!!

The Cap going to 110 M range is already set in stone because the deal that will push the cap in that range was already signed in real life.

[Bryan Colangelo]

i accept

[JR Wiles]

Mar 19, 2016 15:04:05 GMT Hanamichi Sakuragi said:

Mar 19, 2016 12:49:09 GMT JR Wiles said:

Stop assumimg the cap will do anything. You guys let this trade go through and Wall leaves then what. Just because the cap is going up does not mean it will continue to go up. Portland gives up the most here to get George who it looks is back to his old self. Irving and Wall are an even call except for Walls salary of course. Deng and Anderson is about equal as long as health isnt a factor. Im not sure who wins or who will get or be better with this deal. I think Denver wins short term. This is a fair trade and i would accept. I just hope these guys just didnt screw their playoff dreams. They were both in it. Denver had to get better to be a contender which he does. Only reason this trade is made. Portland does not get better in my opinion. I hope the teams chemistry will work out. Teams are trading because of GS getting Lebron. Thanks to Miami and its stupid move. Miami might not get in the east. Cant wait until this passes and to see the outcome.

Go Spurs!!

The Cap going to 110 M range is already set in stone because the deal that will push the cap in that range was already signed in real life.

Yes the cap is scheduled to go up as long as there is not a stoppage at the end of the 2017-2018 season. After the 2018-2019 season no matter if there is a stoppage or not the cap for the following three years is suppose to fall. Nearing 100 million after jumping high the previous few seasons. Just like with players...nothing is set in stone. Things happen. I for one dont think we should be making decisions based on anything more than a year. But you guys do what you want anyway. It will be interesting to see if things go as outlined.

[Deleted]

Mar 19, 2016 15:13:14 GMT JR Wiles said:

I for one dont think we should be making decisions based on anything more than a year.

Oh... it all makes sense now!

[JR Wiles]

Mar 19, 2016 15:44:44 GMT @riogho said:

Mar 19, 2016 15:13:14 GMT JR Wiles said:

I for one dont think we should be making decisions based on anything more than a year.

Oh... it all makes sense now!

What does? You starting again?

Im stating that we cant be predicting the future to far down the road. Thats all. The cap is going up because of the tv deal and then its going to fall by ALOT before increasing little by little. The future cap is going to be more near the $100 million Mark and increasing slowly like it should. Thats not to say the league and the players dont have a stoppage before hand because of such issues.

You look at players that are suppose to be great and years later they are average or below that. Thats looking at the future without seeing the truth and reality.

Im not trying to fight with anyone. I just think you guys assume to much, too quick!!

[Jeremiah Hill]

Mar 19, 2016 14:39:10 GMT Ian Noble said:

Mar 19, 2016 12:59:57 GMT Jeremiah Hill said:

Also Portland, IDK if you realized but you won't be able to resign Paul George unless you gut your team.

The Blazers will have $53,445,927 on the books when the off season starts, that's almost $40m in cap space, more than enough to re-sign Kyrie. PG is not expiring.

Yeah, they resign Kyrie and then have to just sit on 20 million in space for two years because no one decent is accepting 2 year deals.