Clint Capela - MIN (BR)

[Brandon Roy]

Damn too close

[Jeremiah Hill]

Jul 8, 2017 6:17:37 GMT Bryan Colangelo said:

Jul 7, 2017 22:38:15 GMT Walt Frazier said:

To be honest, it slipped my mind to specifically ask for it. I think some of that is on the PA, but as a PA, I know I consider that, so I assume other PA's do as well. The player would 100% in every single case, no exceptions, want to allow the team he is returning to the opportunity to use their cap space to improve the team they are returning to. It's a no brainer.

FTR, I'm assuming Colangelo either forgot he was a BR guy or is too busy himself and it slipped by him. He only officially told me he was going to re-sign here minutes before he posted it, so I didn't get the chance to ask him to delay the posting until I used my cap space.

Fuck he was on bird rights. I'm sorry Walt this shouldn't waited. I was just catching up with everything

If we uncap this deal and force Walt to match Josh's 20 mil I have no problems with him signing Crowder to fix his BRs. I might be alone in this though.

[Hanamichi Sakuragi]

Ooopps. Screwed.

I understand both side. I will support Ian's decision with the controversies on hand.

[Ian Noble]

I'll leave this thread here but will add the contract to Minnesota's books later. Bryan Colangelo forgot about Bird Rights players signing later in the process, if that makes people scream conspiracy then... well then I suppose I wont be surprised since there's always an OSFA drama once a year, but it seems fair to me.

Walt's TWolves are the first team this year who've had an incorrectly timed re-signing this year. You can say that happened to the Bucks, but the $7m cap space they had to start OSFA is not going to re-sign Avery Bradley. Walt is quite clearly trying to re-sign Crowder however and Bryan just pulled the trigger too soon on this Capela re-signing. I'd make the same decision for any other team.

[Hanamichi Sakuragi]

Jul 8, 2017 11:36:57 GMT Ian Noble said:

I'll leave this thread here but will add the contract to Minnesota's books later. Bryan Colangelo forgot about Bird Rights players signing later in the process, if that makes people scream conspiracy then... well then I suppose I wont be surprised since there's always an OSFA drama once a year, but it seems fair to me.

Walt's TWolves are the first team this year who've had an incorrectly timed re-signing this year. You can say that happened to the Bucks, but the $7m cap space they had to start OSFA is not going to re-sign Avery Bradley. Walt is quite clearly trying to re-sign Crowder however and Bryan just pulled the trigger too soon on this Capela re-signing. I'd make the same decision for any other team.

I second the decision. 

[Jeremiah Hill]

Jul 8, 2017 11:36:57 GMT Ian Noble said:

I'll leave this thread here but will add the contract to Minnesota's books later. Bryan Colangelo forgot about Bird Rights players signing later in the process, if that makes people scream conspiracy then... well then I suppose I wont be surprised since there's always an OSFA drama once a year, but it seems fair to me.

Walt's TWolves are the first team this year who've had an incorrectly timed re-signing this year. You can say that happened to the Bucks, but the $7m cap space they had to start OSFA is not going to re-sign Avery Bradley. Walt is quite clearly trying to re-sign Crowder however and Bryan just pulled the trigger too soon on this Capela re-signing. I'd make the same decision for any other team.

Can we get a talking too about BS contract capping as well? 

[Kevin Hollis]

So Walt got a 7 million discount for no reason? I don't understand this at all. If he offered 22M, how did we come up with a discount to 15M? Makes no sense at all.

[Kevin Hollis]

Jul 8, 2017 11:36:57 GMT Ian Noble said:

I'll leave this thread here but will add the contract to Minnesota's books later. Bryan Colangelo forgot about Bird Rights players signing later in the process, if that makes people scream conspiracy then... well then I suppose I wont be surprised since there's always an OSFA drama once a year, but it seems fair to me.

Walt's TWolves are the first team this year who've had an incorrectly timed re-signing this year. You can say that happened to the Bucks, but the $7m cap space they had to start OSFA is not going to re-sign Avery Bradley. Walt is quite clearly trying to re-sign Crowder however and Bryan just pulled the trigger too soon on this Capela re-signing. I'd make the same decision for any other team.

People always complain because the issues usually revolve around the same people - just my opinion.

[Kevin Hollis]

Jul 8, 2017 12:11:45 GMT Jeremiah Hill said:

Jul 8, 2017 11:36:57 GMT Ian Noble said:

I'll leave this thread here but will add the contract to Minnesota's books later. Bryan Colangelo forgot about Bird Rights players signing later in the process, if that makes people scream conspiracy then... well then I suppose I wont be surprised since there's always an OSFA drama once a year, but it seems fair to me.

Walt's TWolves are the first team this year who've had an incorrectly timed re-signing this year. You can say that happened to the Bucks, but the $7m cap space they had to start OSFA is not going to re-sign Avery Bradley. Walt is quite clearly trying to re-sign Crowder however and Bryan just pulled the trigger too soon on this Capela re-signing. I'd make the same decision for any other team.

Can we get a talking too about BS contract capping as well? 

It needs to be discussed because if he offered 22m like he said and the contract was reduced to 15.5m, that's a problem that needs to be addressed before it gets pushed under the rug.

[James Kay]

Jul 8, 2017 15:59:37 GMT Kevin Hollis said:

Jul 8, 2017 12:11:45 GMT Jeremiah Hill said:

Can we get a talking too about BS contract capping as well? 

It needs to be discussed because if he offered 22m like he said and the contract was reduced to 15.5m, that's a problem that needs to be addressed before it gets pushed under the rug.

Agreed. Players that are young like Capela shouldn't be 'capped.'

If Walt said, "i'm only paying this much" and Capela decided he wanted to stay with the Wolves, that's a whole other story. that's negotiation. but if it's a young player that's not really focused on competing, Walt probably should've had to pay as much as other people were offering.

Also, Ian Noble , if Capela is having his contract reverted back to the cap hold for this off season (as it should), Glenn should ABSOLUTELY have Davis and Beal reverted back to their cap holds as well - and this is coming from someone who is one of MILs rival teams in the East

[Jared Montini]

Jul 8, 2017 17:20:02 GMT James Kay said:

Jul 8, 2017 15:59:37 GMT Kevin Hollis said:

It needs to be discussed because if he offered 22m like he said and the contract was reduced to 15.5m, that's a problem that needs to be addressed before it gets pushed under the rug.

Agreed. Players that are young like Capela shouldn't be 'capped.'

If Walt said, "i'm only paying this much" and Capela decided he wanted to stay with the Wolves, that's a whole other story. that's negotiation. but if it's a young player that's not really focused on competing, Walt probably should've had to pay as much as other people were offering.

Also, Ian Noble , if Capela is having his contract reverted back to the cap hold for this off season (as it should), Glenn should ABSOLUTELY have Davis and Beal reverted back to their cap holds as well - and this is coming from someone who is one of MILs rival teams in the East

Agreed, you can't just do it for one team. I also think if you're going to let capela go unsigned until after, then people should be able to offer again or he has to pay at least 20 mil

[Ian Noble]

FYI - looking through the thread of offers that Bryan kept, Capela only received one offer that was higher than the one for which he signed and it was retracted by the GM who offered it.

[Andrei Kirilenko]

Jul 8, 2017 17:45:37 GMT Ian Noble said:

FYI - looking through the thread of offers that Bryan kept, Capela only received one offer that was higher than the one for which he signed and it was retracted by the GM who offered it.

I think this contract is extremely cheap for Capela, but maybe not outrageously cheap which is why I haven't been in here arguing about the cap. But, as the other team bidding for Capela, the negotiations went something like...

1. Nets initially offer $16m starting w/ max raises. Nice big write up, guaranteeing starting position, etc.
2. Nets are told Minnesota has guaranteed starting position & Capela favors Minnesota unless Walt decides to not match one of my offers.
3. Nets off $22m per year for 4 years.
4. Timberwolves match offer.
5. Nets are told Capela's contract will be capped. Thus there is no way we can get him, we retract offer and end negotiations.
6. Capela signs for deal starting at $15.5m

[Walt Frazier]

Jul 8, 2017 17:58:14 GMT Andrei Kirilenko said:

Jul 8, 2017 17:45:37 GMT Ian Noble said:

FYI - looking through the thread of offers that Bryan kept, Capela only received one offer that was higher than the one for which he signed and it was retracted by the GM who offered it.

I think this contract is extremely cheap for Capela, but maybe not outrageously cheap which is why I haven't been in here arguing about the cap. But, as the other team bidding for Capela, the negotiations went something like...

1. Nets initially offer $16m starting w/ max raises. Nice big write up, guaranteeing starting position, etc.
2. Nets are told Minnesota has guaranteed starting position & Capela favors Minnesota unless Walt decides to not match one of my offers.
3. Nets off $22m per year for 4 years.
4. Timberwolves match offer.
5. Nets are told Capela's contract will be capped. Thus there is no way we can get him, we retract offer and end negotiations.
6. Capela signs for deal starting at $15.5m

For whatever it's worth (honestly I don't know but it feels worth mentioning), the contract signed isn't some random number. It is the contract I sent in my first pitch to Clint.

[Andrei Kirilenko]

Jul 8, 2017 18:00:07 GMT Walt Frazier said:

Jul 8, 2017 17:58:14 GMT Andrei Kirilenko said:

I think this contract is extremely cheap for Capela, but maybe not outrageously cheap which is why I haven't been in here arguing about the cap. But, as the other team bidding for Capela, the negotiations went something like...

1. Nets initially offer $16m starting w/ max raises. Nice big write up, guaranteeing starting position, etc.
2. Nets are told Minnesota has guaranteed starting position & Capela favors Minnesota unless Walt decides to not match one of my offers.
3. Nets off $22m per year for 4 years.
4. Timberwolves match offer.
5. Nets are told Capela's contract will be capped. Thus there is no way we can get him, we retract offer and end negotiations.
6. Capela signs for deal starting at $15.5m

For whatever it's worth (honestly I don't know but it feels worth mentioning), the contract signed isn't some random number. It is the contract I sent in my first pitch to Clint.

I think it is reasonably fair, as it is close to my initial offer as well. I do think it is on the low side and he will get maxed or close to max in real-life, but if that's what Bryan thought was fair then I don't think it is outrageous enough to question his judgment.

I think the better question that has been raised is if we should be capping contracts at all. It does sorta defeat the purpose of having a max contract. It also makes it extremely difficult for teams to use cap room.

[Ian Noble]

Walt Frazier - you've got lucky and got a good deal from Bryan with this signing, I wont disagree with anyone about that.

On balance I feel like that's just how things play out some times though? Sometimes you get lucky, sometimes Danny Longley forgets to cap bidding and Enes Kanter ends up with the largest single contract in the history of the league!

[James Kay]

No offense meant to Bryan, I'm well aware that being a PA is one of the most difficult and thankless jobs in the league.

But IMO, what should have been done is this:

Walt makes his initial offer, so does Josh. Capela expresses to Josh that he received a similar offer from the Wolves, and would prefer to stay there. Josh increases his offer to the max.

Capela turns to Walt and says, hey, I'd rather stay with the Wolves as this is my home, and we're a young growing contending team. But the Nets offered me a max contract. How about you increase you offer by about 1-2 million per year and we call it a deal.


There needs to be a balance between players getting the most money they can out of negotiations and also player loyalty/preferences.

this would lead to a more "natural capping" of contracts, where teams aren't forced to match outrageously high bidding prices driven up by the abundance of bottoming teams with tons of cap space, but also accounts for the fact that more money IS out there.

[Vlade Divac]

Jul 8, 2017 18:05:02 GMT Ian Noble said:

Walt Frazier - you've got lucky and got a good deal from Bryan with this signing, I wont disagree with anyone about that.

On balance I feel like that's just how things play out some times though? Sometimes you get lucky, sometimes Danny Longley forgets to cap bidding and Enes Kanter ends up with the largest single contract in the history of the league!

Let us not forget why we have cap holds in the first place! dynasty5ive.proboards.com/thread/2777/josh-smith

[Deleted]

Lol this thread