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Post by Walt Frazier on Apr 26, 2016 1:38:01 GMT
2015-16 NBA Most Improved Player34:44 mpg. 20.8ppg / 3.2rpg / 4.3apg / 1.2spg. 44.8% FG / 41.7% 3PT / 82.7% FT I'm not sure if I really need to say much else here. He had an absolutely amazing season. Elite 3PT%, very good FT%, pretty solid FG% for a guard. 20+ points, not an accident. His team was the 5th seed in the West. He picks up some steals. He hands out a very good chunk of assists for a non PG (though he does play there some, which is another testament to his versatility and good game we need to give him credit for in our ratings). Current: 78 Suggested: 84
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Post by James Kay on Apr 26, 2016 5:54:03 GMT
84
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 27, 2024 16:54:55 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2016 13:03:36 GMT
81
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Vlade Divac
Former Kings GM
Sophomore
Posts: 630
Oct 20, 2024 15:22:14 GMT
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Post by Vlade Divac on Apr 26, 2016 23:59:47 GMT
While I do not get a vote anymore, I think Walt deserves a great deal of credit for taking McCollum.
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Post by Charles Barkley on Apr 27, 2016 23:26:53 GMT
Def not an 84 Walt.......
I'll play the,"he has only done it for one year" card and ask that we not rank him higher than IT2, the same as Khris Middleton, and 1 less than DeMar.
81
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Post by Walt Frazier on Apr 28, 2016 0:55:22 GMT
Def not an 84 Walt....... I'll play the,"he has only done it for one year" card and ask that we not rank him higher than IT2, the same as Khris Middleton, and 1 less than DeMar. 81 I don't really think that's an accurate set of players for comparison. IT2 is the closest of the group but he's asked to be more of a PG than McCollum. I made the argument in his old thread that he's really been doing the same things since his college years, just didn't get the PT the past two years to show it. But yea, it's a valid argument overall, but he's shown this efficiency in the past, I'd just ask that we are aware of that whole picture. |
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Post by James Kay on Apr 28, 2016 1:28:24 GMT
Def not an 84 Walt....... I'll play the,"he has only done it for one year" card and ask that we not rank him higher than IT2, the same as Khris Middleton, and 1 less than DeMar. 81 I don't really think that's an accurate set of players for comparison. IT2 is the closest of the group but he's asked to be more of a PG than McCollum. I made the argument in his old thread that he's really been doing the same things since his college years, just didn't get the PT the past two years to show it. But yea, it's a valid argument overall, but he's shown this efficiency in the past, I'd just ask that we are aware of that whole picture. Yeah, just as another response: an entire years worth of play is totally enough time. 3/4 of a year or 1/2 of a year or 1/4 year is not, but McCollum played well the entire year |
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Post by Walt Frazier on Apr 28, 2016 2:28:25 GMT
I don't really think that's an accurate set of players for comparison. IT2 is the closest of the group but he's asked to be more of a PG than McCollum. I made the argument in his old thread that he's really been doing the same things since his college years, just didn't get the PT the past two years to show it. But yea, it's a valid argument overall, but he's shown this efficiency in the past, I'd just ask that we are aware of that whole picture. Yeah, just as another response: an entire years worth of play is totally enough time. 3/4 of a year or 1/2 of a year or 1/4 year is not, but McCollum played well the entire year 100%. If anything, his 2nd "half" was better than his 1st half. 44.2 / 39.2 / 79.7 rose to 45.9 / 47.1 / 87.5 Points/Ast/Stl/Blk/TO all very stable 1st half to 2nd, but rebounds did go down (he's not getting many of his points there anyway). Month to month, here's how it looks. 45.8 / 40.9 / 100 (3 games) 44.7 / 37.8 / 86.0 44.4 / 41.9 / 75.6 42.9 / 34.6 / 75.0 45.2 / 45.2 / 83.3 44.2 / 45.7 / 88.2 51.5 / 50.0 / 81.0 Anyone who looks at players month to month knows there's always peaks and valleys, but overall that's pretty damn consistent and an INSANE finish to the season, albeit in 6 games in April. His worst PPG in a month was 19.4 in November. His best PPG was 22.7 in October and April, 22.3 in December. Assists range from 3.6 in November to 5.3 in December. Really a great year. I'd say compare him to a guy like Kevin Martin, maybe? But already with a much better passing / dribble ability, probably more blocks overall too (not a lot of points but I like to consider everything). Little better defensive reputation than KMart had already too. Martin, I don't know what he maxed out as. I know in the time of this league he was at least an 81 but that was really towards the end of his prime, and again McCollum has advantages on him and almost no disadvantages. A full year is a full year, and he has similar %'s overall in his career and college. FT% very low the last two years but that's sample size and PT issues, IMO. He's already a 40.8% 3PT guy for his career, 44.3% FG for his career. Established in those areas by now. Anyway, yes, a full year, consistent, established, looks pretty stable to me. |
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Apr 28, 2016 3:16:43 GMT
83
I think that we underrate SG.
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Apr 28, 2016 13:20:09 GMT
Just to elaborate on my post. I think that the best shooting guard (Harden) is less OVR than the bests of any other position. Some of those positions have several better players IMO. But isn't one of the things with SGs is that there are a lot of good not great players or great with a big flaw players at SG. I think McCollum falls into the good not great category now.
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Deleted
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Nov 27, 2024 16:54:55 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2016 19:46:49 GMT
Just to elaborate on my post. I think that the best shooting guard (Harden) is less OVR than the bests of any other position. Some of those positions have several better players IMO. But isn't one of the things with SGs is that there are a lot of good not great players or great with a big flaw players at SG. I think McCollum falls into the good not great category now. because the shooting guards in the league suck of course we are gonna rate them lower. its about skill points and on average, the shooting guards in this league are less skilled than the point guards. they are the same thing but shittier at passing, and usually have shittier advanced defensive stats |
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Post by Hanamichi Sakuragi on Apr 30, 2016 5:07:14 GMT
80
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Apr 30, 2016 14:31:14 GMT
Just to elaborate on my post. I think that the best shooting guard (Harden) is less OVR than the bests of any other position. Some of those positions have several better players IMO. But isn't one of the things with SGs is that there are a lot of good not great players or great with a big flaw players at SG. I think McCollum falls into the good not great category now. because the shooting guards in the league suck of course we are gonna rate them lower. its about skill points and on average, the shooting guards in this league are less skilled than the point guards. they are the same thing but shittier at passing, and usually have shittier advanced defensive stats I agree that they aren't as good as some of the others positions but they aren't that bad. |
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Deleted
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Nov 27, 2024 16:54:55 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2016 14:37:46 GMT
because the shooting guards in the league suck of course we are gonna rate them lower. its about skill points and on average, the shooting guards in this league are less skilled than the point guards. they are the same thing but shittier at passing, and usually have shittier advanced defensive stats I agree that they aren't as good as some of the others positions but they aren't that bad. they also have way less skills on average that need points in the sim. most SG in this league just stand there and chuck, and then suck at defense. |
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Post by Charles Barkley on Apr 30, 2016 18:27:05 GMT
I agree that they aren't as good as some of the others positions but they aren't that bad. they also have way less skills on average that need points in the sim. most SG in this league just stand there and chuck, and then suck at defense. I think the skill disparity in PG vs SG is more due to the fact that PGs are now scorers, where in the past they were anything but scorers. So now, you have PGs scoring and passing. SGs are also worse, on average, at defense than PGs, which is hard to imagine when you consider how bad the PG defense is. |
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Deleted
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Nov 27, 2024 16:54:55 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2016 18:28:07 GMT
Shooting guards are just less skilled by nature of their position; if they could pass and run an offense they'd be a point guard.
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Apr 30, 2016 18:37:27 GMT
they also have way less skills on average that need points in the sim. most SG in this league just stand there and chuck, and then suck at defense. I think the skill disparity in PG vs SG is more due to the fact that PGs are now scorers, where in the past they were anything but scorers. So now, you have PGs scoring and passing. SGs are also worse, on average, at defense than PGs, which is hard to imagine when you consider how bad the PG defense is. But this has already been accounted for by a ton of our PGs being 80ovr or higher. McCollum is more combo guard than anything he's averaging nearly 5 assists per game and scoring 20 ppg. That gets 85s for Point Guards in this league. He's reasonable on defense. I also disagree that SG's are worse than PGs on defense. I always thought that there size helped them greatly. The best defensive PG is worse on D than the best defensive SG IMO. |
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Post by Charles Barkley on Apr 30, 2016 18:50:00 GMT
I think the skill disparity in PG vs SG is more due to the fact that PGs are now scorers, where in the past they were anything but scorers. So now, you have PGs scoring and passing. SGs are also worse, on average, at defense than PGs, which is hard to imagine when you consider how bad the PG defense is. But this has already been accounted for by a ton of our PGs being 80ovr or higher. McCollum is more combo guard than anything he's averaging nearly 5 assists per game and scoring 20 ppg. That gets 85s for Point Guards in this league. He's reasonable on defense. I also disagree that SG's are worse than PGs on defense. I always thought that there size helped them greatly. The best defensive PG is worse on D than the best defensive SG IMO. In terms of defense, that is why I said on average. Nothing about the best vs the best. Because, you have more SGs out there who are just defensive specialists, who are just out there to guard people. Where as even the best defensive PGs are still decent on offense and doing other things besides just guarding people. Don't believe me? Look at how many times down the floor a guy like Tony Allen (1st Team All-Defense) doesn't touch the ball. Where as a guy like Pat Beverly is highly involved in the offense. |
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Post by Brandon Roy on May 13, 2016 7:14:02 GMT
82
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Kevin Hollis
Former Thunder GM for 7 years
All Star
Posts: 2,838 
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Post by Kevin Hollis on May 13, 2016 18:22:46 GMT
80
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Post by Walt Frazier on May 15, 2016 3:46:12 GMT
80 - 80 - 81 - 81 - 82 - 83 - 84 - 84 = 81.833 = 82 as of now.
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Minnesota Timberwolves
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