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Post by James Kay on Mar 10, 2015 16:51:59 GMT
Khris Middleton, IMO, is currently one of the more underrated players in the league, as he’s on “over-performing” small-market MIL he often gets overlooked. If he was on a big-market team like NY or LA, fans would be drooling over his potential. Anyway, Khris is essentially the prototypical player of the NBA future. Sniper shooting with a lanky body. His length allows him to disrupt passing lanes but more importantly, he’s able to switch easily and intelligently. I’d say he’s pretty easily the 2nd best 3 and D guy in the league behind Klay Thompson.
Let’s look at some stats: He didn’t start the season as a starter, but he has started the past 33 games. In those games he’s put up 15 points, 5 boards, 2.5 assists, and 2 steals in 32.5 minutes. He’s super efficient, shooting 50 % from the field and 43% from three over this period. Now, I don’t know how to extrapolate advanced stats for his performance over just his starts, but over the entire season he’s had a 57 TS%, a 16.3 PER, and .149 WS/48. He also has a 111 ORTG and a 101 DRTG, in addition to a 14.6 point on/off swing for the Bucks when he is on/off the court. That’s pretty substantial. He also is able to play the 2, 3, and 4, spending 65% of his time as a PF, 12% as a SF, and 20% as a SG. Just thought that was worth noting, a PF that can shoot 43% from three is no joke.
Last thing to keep in mind is that those advanced stats include the first half of the season where he didn’t start, so they’ll be slightly lower. Also worth noting is that his scoring is increasing every game.
Now for my rating, it’s my opinion that an average defensive player, putting up those box stats at 50% from the field and 43% from three, is worthy of a 78-79, at least. Because Middleton is so skilled on the defensive end, I think this rating should be adjusted 2-3 points to account for that. So my suggested rating is 81-82
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Post by Alex English on Mar 10, 2015 17:15:26 GMT
I like him. But he's not an 80+ player. I'll say 79.
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Post by Brian Scalabrine on Mar 10, 2015 17:21:45 GMT
78
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Post by James Kay on Mar 10, 2015 17:26:51 GMT
I like him. But he's not an 80+ player. I'll say 78. Interesting rating considering you rated Pat Patterson a 78-79 only ~20days ago, especially since Middleton is basically averaging double his points and steals, while shooting way better, and playing defense better as well. But Middleton isn’t even worth that -79 that you gave to Patterson ?lol |
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Post by Sam Bowie on Mar 10, 2015 17:44:00 GMT
Why do you want Middleton´s rating to go up anyway?  You said before you are afraid there might be a bidding war for Middleton during off-season. If his rating goes up to 80 or so, there will be war!  |
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Post by Alex English on Mar 10, 2015 17:46:09 GMT
I like him. But he's not an 80+ player. I'll say 78. Interesting rating considering you rated Pat Patterson a 78-79 only ~20days ago, especially since Middleton is basically averaging double his points and steals, while shooting way better, and playing defense better as well. But Middleton isn’t even worth that -79 that you gave to Patterson ?lol Double his points? Where are you getting your stats from? He averages 4.2 more points because he averages 3.3 more attempts. Also, he isn't a better shooter, Patterson has a higher TS% and eFG%. He's a better rebounder too. I can see your point though. Middleton has higher raw stats and a bigger role on the Bucks. I'll raise my vote by one. He's still not worth an 80 rating. |
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Post by James Kay on Mar 10, 2015 18:20:29 GMT
Interesting rating considering you rated Pat Patterson a 78-79 only ~20days ago, especially since Middleton is basically averaging double his points and steals, while shooting way better, and playing defense better as well. But Middleton isn’t even worth that -79 that you gave to Patterson ?lol Double his points? Where are you getting your stats from? He averages 4.2 more points because he averages 3.3 more attempts. Also, he isn't a better shooter, Patterson has a higher TS% and eFG%. He's a better rebounder too. I can see your point though. Middleton has higher raw stats and a bigger role on the Bucks. I'll raise my vote by one. He's still not worth an 80 rating. Sorry, I should have made it clear that I’m working with Middleton’s last 33 games (when he began starting), which I think is pretty reasonable to use given that he’s a developing player finally getting playing time. Good point about the TS and eFG but is that just because PP is taking more threes? Middleton has a better FG% and 3p%. Middleton takes 3.1 threes a game, PP takes 3.5 a game. Middleton shoots the three at .426 and PP shoots it at .396. Genuinely curious how that works out, and does that mean that PP is a better shooter? Middleton gets to the line more and shoots at a better clip to boot.. PP does shoot about 54% from 2p and Middleton shoots at .495.. so is that where the difference in TS and eFG comes from? |
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Glenn Robinson
 Milwaukee Bucks
Starter
Posts: 1,226
Nov 22, 2024 4:29:32 GMT
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Post by Glenn Robinson on Mar 10, 2015 18:29:41 GMT
Middleton did start at the beginning of the year but was regulated to the bench for a stint but then got reinserted back into the starting lineup. Also, he isn't a better shooter, Patterson has a higher TS% and eFG%. Middleton is a vastly better shooter than Patterson and it's not even close. Patterson has a better TS% on a much lower usage rate. Middleton is also 7th in real plus/minus. That's up there with the likes of Curry, Harden, James, Westbrook, Paul and Davis. With that being said, the highest I would go for Middleton right now is 79. He still needs to work on his handle and creating for himself off the dribble. He's gotten much better, but the majority of plays run for him are off screens or him posting up. He needs to stay consistent with his scoring as well. Hopefully that comes with more attempts now that Brandon Knight is in Phoenix. |
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 26, 2024 22:38:15 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2015 18:34:30 GMT
Middleton is waiver wire trash. 77
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Post by Charles Barkley on Mar 10, 2015 18:59:16 GMT
I'll say 78 for now. He reminds me off a less polished Kawhi. Middleton's strengths are typical strengths for guys his size, example, a lot of guys can 3 and D. But Middleton shoots it so well.
The question is: Can Middleton further develop his game? And I think that is the question with a lot of the Bucks roster. And I think that is why they traded for MCW, who can make other players better. The Bucks could be really scary if their guys keep developing. MCW-Middleton-Giannis-Parker-Henson. And really, Middleton, like James mentioned, can be a 2-3-4 and Giannis can be a 1-2-3-4. They are probably one of my favorite teams to watch on League Pass.
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Post by James Kay on Mar 10, 2015 20:12:16 GMT
Middleton is waiver wire trash. 77 lol good for you but as someone who was planning on going all-in on andrea bargnani-lite, i'm more than a little skeptical of your ability to judge players. |
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 26, 2024 22:38:15 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2015 21:11:27 GMT
Middleton is waiver wire trash. 77 lol good for you but as someone who was planning on going all-in on andrea bargnani-lite, i'm more than a little skeptical of your ability to judge players. whiteside and mirotic will take me to the finals! |
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Post by Hanamichi Sakuragi on Mar 10, 2015 23:47:46 GMT
too early..
We became conservative for a lot of guys like Draymond so I think we also need to be consistent and be conservative here too.
77
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Post by Walt Frazier on Mar 11, 2015 0:47:31 GMT
79 for me.
Side note - I came in ready to type 80 and when my fingers went to do it, my brain shouted "no, not yet!" So, there you go.
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Kevin Hollis
Former Thunder GM for 7 years
All Star
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Post by Kevin Hollis on Mar 11, 2015 13:29:52 GMT
78
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Post by James Kay on Mar 12, 2015 14:16:38 GMT
No big deal, he just dropped 30 last night. Are you guys watching this kid? His scoring has increased every month. In November 7.9ppg. December 10.5ppg. January 12.9 ppg. February 16.5 ppg. Since the trade deadline – 20.9ppg. Double digits in the last 17 straight games. Since the All-Star Break, he's averaging 19.0/5.3/3.2 on .497/.488/.882 in 35.5 MPG. He’s playing better offense and defense than Ariza and Parsons, and both of them are rated 81, his best comparisons to play style, IMO.
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Post by Alex English on Mar 12, 2015 16:08:08 GMT
No big deal, he just dropped 30 last night. I agree, it is no big deal. A 30 point game doesn't really mean anything. Here are some other players with 30+ point games this year: Mo Williams (52), Kemba Walker (42), Victor Oladipo (38), Kevin Martin (37), Brandon Jennings (37), Lou Williams (36), Markieff Morris (35), Jeff Green (35), DJ Augustin (35), Rodney Stuckey (34), Jodie Meeks (34), Tobias Harris (34), Arron Afflalo (34), Perry Jones (32), Avery Bradley (32), Tony Wroten (31), Donald Sloan (31), Isaiah Canaan (31), Aaron Brooks (31), CJ Miles (30), Kelly Olynyk (30). Plenty of average players put up big numbers. Looking at Middleton's whole resume, I don't buy that he's an 80+ player. He still only averages 12.8 points and 4.5 rebounds in 28.6 minutes. That's nothing incredible. A 77-79 rating is still a solid rating. Lets see him come back next year and start averaging 15+ points per game with other good stats. Then I think we can look at an 80+ for him. |
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Post by James Kay on Mar 12, 2015 16:53:18 GMT
No big deal, he just dropped 30 last night. I agree, it is no big deal. A 30 point game doesn't really mean anything. Here are some other players with 30+ point games this year: Mo Williams (52), Kemba Walker (42), Victor Oladipo (38), Kevin Martin (37), Brandon Jennings (37), Lou Williams (36), Markieff Morris (35), Jeff Green (35), DJ Augustin (35), Rodney Stuckey (34), Jodie Meeks (34), Tobias Harris (34), Arron Afflalo (34), Perry Jones (32), Avery Bradley (32), Tony Wroten (31), Donald Sloan (31), Isaiah Canaan (31), Aaron Brooks (31), CJ Miles (30), Kelly Olynyk (30). Plenty of average players put up big numbers. Looking at Middleton's whole resume, I don't buy that he's an 80+ player. He still only averages 12.8 points and 4.5 rebounds in 28.6 minutes. That's nothing incredible. A 77-79 rating is still a solid rating. Lets see him come back next year and start averaging 15+ points per game with other good stats. Then I think we can look at an 80+ for him. Did any of them score their 30+ point games within 2 games of another 30 point game? Middleton has had two 30 point games in the last 3 games. Not saying that = an auto 80+ rating, but I think people are underestimating him and his performance. When you mention his scoring total its really weighed down by a slow start. Besides, Middleton is without a doubt the best defender of any of those players on that list. But hey Im not gonna really push the point any further, its great that you took the time to look up and mention those players. His rating will be what it will be. Also – is mo Williams on a team right now? Or is he a FA? |
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Post by Charles Barkley on Mar 12, 2015 18:49:02 GMT
I think Khris falls in with a lot of other guys we rate like this. We always say, "Let us see him do it for longer before going higher" and I think he fits that category just like a lot of other guys we have rated.
I see the potential for this kid, but I just don't want to jump out of the gate and rate him high only to have him not meet expectations. And, at the same time, I think what people are rating him at right now is pretty fair.
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Deleted
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Nov 26, 2024 22:38:15 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2015 21:27:28 GMT
Middleton is legit I eat my crow
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Post by James Kay on Nov 8, 2015 22:23:48 GMT
Middleton is legit I eat my crow lol im inclined to say the same about mirotic |
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 26, 2024 22:38:15 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2015 22:32:03 GMT
Middleton is legit I eat my crow lol im inclined to say the same about mirotic Still holding out that whiteside sucks too? |
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Post by James Kay on Nov 9, 2015 0:04:49 GMT
lol im inclined to say the same about mirotic Still holding out that whiteside sucks too? I wasn't anti-Whiteside, I was just pro-Gobert |
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Nov 9, 2015 2:16:14 GMT
If you read my up and comers thing I typed up you'll see that I admit to eating crow on Whiteside.
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