Glenn Robinson
 Milwaukee Bucks
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Posts: 1,226
Nov 22, 2024 4:29:32 GMT
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Post by Glenn Robinson on Jan 25, 2013 14:30:11 GMT
I figured I'd start a thread about him just to see what everyone else thinks.
Davis is currently a 79. He has been putting up pretty good numbers this year. He's currently the second highest rated player in this draft class, behind Lillard.
I'm suggesting Davis be at least what Lillard is (82). I would argue maybe even an 83 but I'd be fine with an 82.
Any thoughts?
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Post by Walt Frazier on Jan 25, 2013 14:38:49 GMT
Generally, I think it's too early, but I don't like that Lillard is higher than him already. It's too early for both but if Lillard was given an 82, I think Davis should be at least equal with him.
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Post by Rubén Magnano on Jan 25, 2013 18:53:46 GMT
I think Lillard has been better so far this season (not by much but better). Also, Davis missed 25% of the games played. I think Davis has more potential than Lillard (he is 3 years younger,etc.) but right now, I don't see why he should be rated higher.
Also, Lillard is a pg. Maybe, you should compare Davis to someone in his position and with similar characteristics if you want his rating to go up. If Noah doesn't get more than a 83 I don't see why Davis should be a 82.
I would give Davis a 81 for now.
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Glenn Robinson
Milwaukee Bucks
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Posts: 1,226
Nov 22, 2024 4:29:32 GMT
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Post by Glenn Robinson on Jan 25, 2013 19:35:48 GMT
I think 82 is completely fair. You said it yourself, he missed 25% of his games this season. Before that he was putting up really good numbers. Almost averaging a double double each night and blocking shots at a very good rate. Lillard is no doubt a very good player, but since we just drafted not that long ago, I don't think it's a stretch to allow Davis be an 82, just purely on potential even. So I think he should be rated at least the same as Lillard at this point given he was the number one pick, and has shown some major game when he wasn't hurt for that short stretch of games. I think to punish him just because he missed some time is foolish.
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Post by Rubén Magnano on Jan 25, 2013 19:44:03 GMT
I think 82 is completely fair. You said it yourself, he missed 25% of his games this season. I didn't say it in a good way, lol. Still, I proposed a 81 rating which is high. Lillard has an 82 because he is the leading ROY candidate. |
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Glenn Robinson
Milwaukee Bucks
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Posts: 1,226
Nov 22, 2024 4:29:32 GMT
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Post by Glenn Robinson on Jan 25, 2013 20:43:07 GMT
You just made my point. It's not a good thing he missed those games, but if he didn't miss them we wouldn't even be having this discussion about Davis rating being a 79. Davis shouldn't have to take such a big hit because he missed some time. Also, we're using NBA 2k13 ratings, which get updated every few weeks. If we used the default ratings, Davis would be much higher and Lillard would be much lower. We just happened to start using the ratings when Davis was starting to come back from his injury. Leading rookie of the year candidate or not. Lillard shouldn't be rated higher than Davis. They can be rated the same, but to have Davis 3 points lower than Lillard isn't acceptable.
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Post by Alex English on Jan 25, 2013 21:40:32 GMT
They can be rated the same, but to have Davis 3 points lower than Lillard isn't acceptable. I think it's a lot more acceptable to have Davis rated 3 points lower than Lillard than to have them equal. Lillard has obviously been better than Davis this season. |
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Glenn Robinson
Milwaukee Bucks
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Posts: 1,226
Nov 22, 2024 4:29:32 GMT
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Post by Glenn Robinson on Jan 25, 2013 22:06:11 GMT
They can be rated the same, but to have Davis 3 points lower than Lillard isn't acceptable. I think it's a lot more acceptable to have Davis rated 3 points lower than Lillard than to have them equal. Lillard has obviously been better than Davis this season. Like I said, if Davis didn't get injured for a short time, we wouldn't even be having this discussion. Compare them when they both started the season and a lot would argue that they were equal. |
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Post by Andrei Kirilenko on Jan 25, 2013 22:08:10 GMT
Davis definitely shouldn't get an increase yet. Big men, and centers in particular, are rated lower than guards in this league. Damien Lillard at an 82 would be probably mid to late 20s in overall guard rankings. Davis at an 82 would be a top 5 center. Plus he hasn't really done anything to warrant a 79, much less an increase to an 82.
Pass.
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Glenn Robinson
Milwaukee Bucks
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Posts: 1,226
Nov 22, 2024 4:29:32 GMT
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Post by Glenn Robinson on Jan 25, 2013 22:53:26 GMT
Nothing to warrant a 79? LOL ... alright
Well I guess I'll just have to wait for the increase.
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Post by Rubén Magnano on Jan 25, 2013 23:46:07 GMT
Nothing to warrant a 79? LOL ... alright Well I guess I'll just have to wait for the increase. I will keep my proposed 81 rating but I think he has a valid point. |
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Post by Walt Frazier on Jan 25, 2013 23:54:49 GMT
I'll put my official vote in as an 82 b/c I think we shouldn't be basing much on real-life yet for these rookies...usually in NBA Live a guy like Davis, coming into the league, would have been an 81 or 82. Normally, if we would have started at the beginning of the season, Lillard would have been like a 74-76. So, yea, we "fixed" Lillard's rating very quickly when Ian put in the Rookies...should have bumped Davis a little bit to make it fair, IMO.
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Post by Clyde Drexler on Jan 26, 2013 0:30:02 GMT
I'll put my official vote in as an 82 b/c I think we shouldn't be basing much on real-life yet for these rookies...usually in NBA Live a guy like Davis, coming into the league, would have been an 81 or 82. Normally, if we would have started at the beginning of the season, Lillard would have been like a 74-76. So, yea, we "fixed" Lillard's rating very quickly when Ian put in the Rookies...should have bumped Davis a little bit to make it fair, IMO. Where do you get these rookie ratings from NBA live? I didn't recall any of the past drafts, so I went over to Legends and checked out our past drafts. Durant, Oden, Rose, Beasley, Evans, Griffin etc. were all rated 77-78. Just curious haha For Davis' rating I think he should be below Lillard and is fine where he is. Maybe a 1 point rating to 80? |
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Post by Alex English on Jan 26, 2013 1:24:12 GMT
I'll put my official vote in as an 82 b/c I think we shouldn't be basing much on real-life yet for these rookies...usually in NBA Live a guy like Davis, coming into the league, would have been an 81 or 82. Normally, if we would have started at the beginning of the season, Lillard would have been like a 74-76. So, yea, we "fixed" Lillard's rating very quickly when Ian put in the Rookies...should have bumped Davis a little bit to make it fair, IMO. I completely disagree with this logic. Pre-season rookie ratings are based on hype and assumptions. As soon as they start playing real games we should completely ignore how good everyone thought they were going to be. Look at Austin Rivers, he sucks at basketball. He wasn't even good at Duke, he's got a hyped up name though so everyone loves him. Davis is averaging a fairly efficient 13, 8 and 2 in 29 minutes per game, 79 sounds just about right for him. |
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Post by Walt Frazier on Jan 26, 2013 1:55:39 GMT
Well, I never thought Rivers would be that great, but that's my opinion and I know he did have some hype.
Generally, I think it's too early for us to change rookie ratings too much. You're right that once some meaningful sample sizes are available, we can start to assess. I'm used to waiting to move rookies for at least a year, but it should be a player-by-player issue.
This goes in response to Clyde as well, but 79 really isn't a bad rating for Davis, I think 82 could be a little high for Lillard "already." That's basically what I thought and hadn't really articulated well before. I was over-thinking and rushing through when I posted that 81-82 thing, you're right that is a little high in general for the top Rookie in the class, though I do think I remember someone with an 80 before, and this class was more highly regarded than even the Durant/Oden class.
Anyway, in a vacuum, I'm OK with a 79 on Davis, but I am not as OK with Lillard already being 3 points ahead of him.
I wouldn't be upset with their ratings at the same spot. I think anywhere in this area is right for both of them at this point, but I don't see one as being significantly better than the other yet. It's only half a season.
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Glenn Robinson
Milwaukee Bucks
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Posts: 1,226
Nov 22, 2024 4:29:32 GMT
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Post by Glenn Robinson on Jan 26, 2013 2:40:30 GMT
To reiterate what some have said, if we are going to keep Davis at a 79 because he's only had a small sample size, why does Lillard get to be up at 82? These pre-rankings are based on hype and potential. Once things get going and they have half a season or more, you can change ratings as you see fit. But to start off with Lillard 3 points ahead just seems odd considering he's only had a small sample size as well. Who's to say Lillard doesn't crap out the second half? We'd be singing a different tune if his numbers drop and Davis' increases.
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Post by Rubén Magnano on Jan 26, 2013 2:43:14 GMT
Once things get going and they have half a season or more, you can change ratings as you see fit. Lillard already played 42 games. |
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Glenn Robinson
Milwaukee Bucks
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Posts: 1,226
Nov 22, 2024 4:29:32 GMT
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Post by Glenn Robinson on Jan 26, 2013 2:44:08 GMT
So? Half a season is half a season. Can we give him a full year before we praise the all mighty Lillard?
*Edit* My post you quoted was only suppose to say full season, I forgot to delete the half a season part.
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Post by Rubén Magnano on Jan 26, 2013 3:00:38 GMT
So? Half a season is half a season. Can we give him a full year before we praise the all mighty Lillard? I was quoting what you said, lol. So, you think Davis should be the ROY top candidate even though Lillard is leading the competition in real life? If we go by hype and potential that should be the case. Most of the potential comes from his young age. Normally, you decrease the rating of younger players... |
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Glenn Robinson
Milwaukee Bucks
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Posts: 1,226
Nov 22, 2024 4:29:32 GMT
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Post by Glenn Robinson on Jan 26, 2013 13:49:51 GMT
Look at my post again, I put an edit in it...
The point is the ratings at the beginning of the year should have at least had Lillard and Davis somewhere in the same ball park. After the year is done, you can adjust ratings based on real life performance, but to judge a performance on half a season seems odd. It would have made more sense if Davis started out the year higher than Lillard, but eventually Lillard getting a boost higher than Davis if he continues his great play for the year. Lillard got his boost instantly, whereas the other rookies didn't.
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Post by Rubén Magnano on Jan 26, 2013 18:24:28 GMT
I don't want to interrupt your search for justice but do you remember that you are in the TC? There is a trade that have been waiting for your vote for the last 2 days...
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Glenn Robinson
Milwaukee Bucks
Starter
Posts: 1,226
Nov 22, 2024 4:29:32 GMT
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Post by Glenn Robinson on Jan 26, 2013 20:49:23 GMT
I don't want to interrupt your search for justice but do you remember that you are in the TC? There is a trade that have been waiting for your vote for the last 2 days... lol wow... Well considering it has one accept thus far and Vlad just accepted it a couple days after it was posted, I'll take a look at it. Don't need to get all butt hurt about it. |
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Post by Rubén Magnano on Jan 26, 2013 23:34:26 GMT
About Davis, as a final observation I think you have a point but I also agree with what the others say. I think half season is not much but it is something. For all that, I believe a 81 is a fair rating with Lillard rated 1 point higher taking also in mind centers are rated much lower than point guards in the league.
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Post by Walt Frazier on Jan 27, 2013 2:33:34 GMT
I'd be ok with an 81 as a sort of mix between "what he should have been rated compared to Lillard to start the season", and the "well, Lillard has outperformed him thus far."
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Post by Walt Frazier on Jun 18, 2013 16:17:16 GMT
Well, season is over for him now, let's take a look!
FT is only at 59 right now, but he made 75%...so, should be a good deal higher.
Off. Awr is only at like 55, he seems pretty competent over there, could probably use some boost.
STL is way down at 31, but he had 1.2 spg IRL, so that needs quite a large boost.
BLK at 83, he was tied for 9th in the league in Blocks per game, tied with Josh Smith and Biyombo. Those two both have block ratings of 90....so he probably could use some boost there.
DEF. Awr is at 82, maybe could use a few more there.
He's at 77 and 80 for OReb and DReb, this is probably ok for now? he had 8.2 rpg in just under 29 mpg, so actually that's pretty good. Probably needs a small boost in both areas.
I think he probably should be higher overall than he is, some areas here make it pretty easy to give him a boost.
He's about 82 for me right now.
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Post by Lew Alcindor on Sept 6, 2013 2:50:21 GMT
Agree 81-82
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Post by Ian Noble on Sept 6, 2013 19:27:47 GMT
Anthony Davis
83, 82, 81, 82, 79, 80, 82, 81
Using the method of removing the highest and lowest and averaging the rest:
79, 80, 81, 81, 82, 82, 82, 83
That gives him an 82.
I'm going to put him on the final rating changes list now.
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