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Post by Jared Montini on Feb 6, 2021 13:58:44 GMT
Rating 77 Suggested 81
this year he’s played about 20 games and some may say that’s not a big enough sample. However, if you combine these 20 games with his last 2 seasons the numbers are still pretty sick.
This season: 24 PPG 4.1 APG 2.4 RPG 1.0SPG on 50-43-83 shooting splits which is fantastic, the dude is a pretty efficient scorer at the guard position.
His 3 year career: 19.1 PPG 3.1APG 2.9RPG on 45-40-84 splits. So even this stat line is worth atleast a 79 so combining this season with that should warrant an 80 overall
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Post by George Gervin on Feb 6, 2021 14:50:08 GMT
80
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Post by Ian Noble on Feb 6, 2021 14:58:55 GMT
81
I think he's going to end up a lot higher than this one day.
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Tim Duncan
Former Jazz GM
Sophomore
Posts: 482
Mar 9, 2022 22:04:51 GMT
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Post by Tim Duncan on Feb 6, 2021 15:02:31 GMT
Well I was waiting to post him to get a larger sample size for votes but a 81 is good for now.
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Post by Steve Nash on Feb 6, 2021 15:14:15 GMT
80
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Amare Stoudemire
Sacramento Kings
Starter
Posts: 2,416
Apr 14, 2024 11:04:23 GMT
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Post by Amare Stoudemire on Feb 6, 2021 15:18:56 GMT
81
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Post by Walt Frazier on Feb 6, 2021 17:19:47 GMT
Hmmm. He's built well in the game already, with things like speed/quick already at 91, and doesn't actually need many more points on his FG/3PT. Maybe a bit on Inside though.
I am going to be a little cautious after looking at his build and go:
79.5
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Post by Jerry West on Feb 6, 2021 18:31:55 GMT
80
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Post by Arvydas Sabonis on Feb 6, 2021 20:52:18 GMT
80
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Post by James Kay on Feb 6, 2021 22:52:49 GMT
Hmmm. He's built well in the game already, with things like speed/quick already at 91, and doesn't actually need many more points on his FG/3PT. Maybe a bit on Inside though. I am going to be a little cautious after looking at his build and go: 79.5 If Sexton, averaging 24 points and 4 assists on his 50/44/83 efficiency is not even cracking 80...
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Post by Walt Frazier on Feb 7, 2021 0:37:35 GMT
Hmmm. He's built well in the game already, with things like speed/quick already at 91, and doesn't actually need many more points on his FG/3PT. Maybe a bit on Inside though. I am going to be a little cautious after looking at his build and go: 79.5 If Sexton, averaging 24 points and 4 assists on his 50/44/83 efficiency is not even cracking 80... Admittedly, my first instinct was to go along with the 80 / 81 range, but for some reason something in the back of my mind said to check on his build. Also, those are his stats / his line for the 18 games, which, is what I'm being cautious about. If he ended the season with a full year of this I'd definitely go over 80. Looking at his current build, below, and trying to be cautious about this year compared to last year, I put him at what would round up to an 80. So, kill me I think I'd probably put the following changes: Overall Rating - 77 FG Shoot - 75 (+ 10) 3Pt Shoot - 84 (+6) FT Shoot - 85 (-2) In Scoring - 51 (+10ish) O Rebound - 20 (+4 to 5) Jumping - 82 Strength - 50 Quickness - 91 Speed - 91 Passing - 36 (no change, maybe add up to 5-6 if I had extra points) Dribbling - 80 O Aware - 81 D Rebound - 25 (-5 to 7) Stealing - 42 (maaaaybe add like 5?) Blocking - 05 (throw a few points here if I had extra) D Aware - 68 (throw points here, though not sure how many are needed) Stamina - 88 (throw points here if I have extra, but not a huge need) So, that's roughly a plus 23 on FG / 3Pt / FT / OReb / INS / DReb And then, pass / steal / block / DAware / Stamina have room for extra if the rating calls for it. I could put a couple on things like strength or dribble or jumping but I think they are all okay where they are. So, anyway, my 2.5 OVR, which equals about 37-38 point increase but rounds up to a 45 point increase, roughly, still seems pretty appropriate even after I dissect it further.
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Post by Alex English on Feb 7, 2021 1:46:55 GMT
82
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Post by Brian Scalabrine on Feb 7, 2021 3:53:20 GMT
80
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Post by Tom Izzo on Feb 7, 2021 5:19:27 GMT
81
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Post by James Kay on Feb 7, 2021 5:26:49 GMT
If Sexton, averaging 24 points and 4 assists on his 50/44/83 efficiency is not even cracking 80... Admittedly, my first instinct was to go along with the 80 / 81 range, but for some reason something in the back of my mind said to check on his build. Also, those are his stats / his line for the 18 games, which, is what I'm being cautious about. If he ended the season with a full year of this I'd definitely go over 80. Looking at his current build, below, and trying to be cautious about this year compared to last year, I put him at what would round up to an 80. So, kill me I think I'd probably put the following changes: Overall Rating - 77 FG Shoot - 75 (+ 10) 3Pt Shoot - 84 (+6) FT Shoot - 85 (-2) In Scoring - 51 (+10ish) O Rebound - 20 (+4 to 5) Jumping - 82 Strength - 50 Quickness - 91 Speed - 91 Passing - 36 (no change, maybe add up to 5-6 if I had extra points) Dribbling - 80 O Aware - 81 D Rebound - 25 (-5 to 7) Stealing - 42 (maaaaybe add like 5?) Blocking - 05 (throw a few points here if I had extra) D Aware - 68 (throw points here, though not sure how many are needed) Stamina - 88 (throw points here if I have extra, but not a huge need) So, that's roughly a plus 23 on FG / 3Pt / FT / OReb / INS / DReb And then, pass / steal / block / DAware / Stamina have room for extra if the rating calls for it. I could put a couple on things like strength or dribble or jumping but I think they are all okay where they are. So, anyway, my 2.5 OVR, which equals about 37-38 point increase but rounds up to a 45 point increase, roughly, still seems pretty appropriate even after I dissect it further. lol. Perhaps I should've finished that thought. I meant that if Collin Sexton can't crack 80 then a lot of people need to rethink a lot of their rankings. Myself included.
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Post by Alex English on Feb 7, 2021 6:13:56 GMT
Compare Sexton with SGA and De'Aaron Fox. They're all young PGs with similar stats on teams with similar records. If Sexton doesn't even deserve an 80 while the other two get 83-85, then our ratings are stupid. Sexton may be the least complete player of the three in terms of playmaking, rebounding and defense, but the difference shouldn't be that big.
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Post by Hanamichi Sakuragi on Feb 7, 2021 7:24:24 GMT
83
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Post by Walt Frazier on Feb 7, 2021 13:45:11 GMT
I'll just add, someone like Fox has been doing this for longer than Sexton, too. Maybe I'm being stubborn about not valuing 18 games over 50-something games from last year.:shrug:
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Post by Jared Montini on Feb 7, 2021 14:31:44 GMT
I'll just add, someone like Fox has been doing this for longer than Sexton, too. Maybe I'm being stubborn about not valuing 18 games over 50-something games from last year.:shrug: last year Bojan Bogdanovic played 60 games averaged less points assists FG% 3P% steals and got an 84 rating. Sexton is averaging 19 per game on good shooting numbers for his career. Feel like an 80 is warranted if fox is getting 5 points higher
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Post by Walt Frazier on Feb 7, 2021 20:59:57 GMT
I'll just add, someone like Fox has been doing this for longer than Sexton, too. Maybe I'm being stubborn about not valuing 18 games over 50-something games from last year.:shrug: last year Bojan Bogdanovic played 60 games averaged less points assists FG% 3P% steals and got an 84 rating. Sexton is averaging 19 per game on good shooting numbers for his career. Feel like an 80 is warranted if fox is getting 5 points higher Bojan is a great example of a player who's ratings were pretty screwy if I'm being honest, lol. I know it's not always a straight line and not always easy, but some players just don't do enough to warrant higher ratings. I think there's a way to put Sexton's ratings, if he gets to an 81 or 82, in places that won't be truly game-wrecking. But, I really think that an 80 is already going to have point in places they aren't fully warranted. I'm just one person though. I know I'm the guy that does Ratings, and I try not to get into that on these threads, lol. Many of you watch a lot more hoops than I do, and I try to just be super objective about where I put points, as much as possible. Anyway, he's having a great season and surely deserves to break 80 based on our past ratings of other similar-ish players, but I'm just pushing a tiny bit to look below the surface and maybe we re-calibrate some things, slowly. This is also the same line of thought for why I've been one of the people who have mentioned that a lot of the hyper-athletic, do-everything wing-types need extra points compared to what we might think they need on the surface. Anyway, I don't have any tried and true or cold-hard facts, or ways to figure out which players exactly need more or less points, and it IS subjective that I sort of just remembered that Collin was one of them, lol. Anyway, I'm literally rambling and typing while watching a show and distracted from both things haha!
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Post by Bryan Colangelo on Feb 10, 2021 16:46:43 GMT
80
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Post by Mark Price on Feb 10, 2021 19:17:54 GMT
83. I'm not going to fight too hard on this since he isn't on my team (hmu Tim Duncan if you want to change that) but he's really good. The Cavs offense has been a dumpster fire all year and he's putting up good numbers efficiently. Sexton is one of those players that people don't like out of the draft, for very fair and obvious reasons, and it takes a while for the perception of him to change. But if he isn't over an 80, than I really don't know what we're doing here with the rating system. We have had Andrew Wiggins as 80+ ever since I've been on here and he's been pretty awful that whole time (this is his first season even sniffing league average TS%) just based on pre-draft perception. There's no way in hell he'd be above 78 if he was drafted 15th overall. If Sexton isn't above an 80, we should all just admit we've never seen a Cavs game and say that we're still working off of what DraftExpress said about him in 2018.
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Post by Mark Price on Feb 10, 2021 19:30:01 GMT
83. I'm not going to fight too hard on this since he isn't on my team (hmu Tim Duncan if you want to change that) but he's really good. The Cavs offense has been a dumpster fire all year and he's putting up good numbers efficiently. Sexton is one of those players that people don't like out of the draft, for very fair and obvious reasons, and it takes a while for the perception of him to change. But if he isn't over an 80, than I really don't know what we're doing here with the rating system. We have had Andrew Wiggins as 80+ ever since I've been on here and he's been pretty awful that whole time (this is his first season even sniffing league average TS%) just based on pre-draft perception. There's no way in hell he'd be above 78 if he was drafted 15th overall. If Sexton isn't above an 80, we should all just admit we've never seen a Cavs game and say that we're still working off of what DraftExpress said about him in 2018. This isn't a shot at Walt Frazier or anything like that. Just speaking more towards the various overall ratings number and not the mechanics that go into ratings and how that effects the game. I think those are two separate conversations as we've seen with players like Giannis who should be a 97 or so, but that rating translates to like 15 points per game for whatever reason.
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Post by Walt Frazier on Feb 11, 2021 4:39:22 GMT
83. I'm not going to fight too hard on this since he isn't on my team (hmu Tim Duncan if you want to change that) but he's really good. The Cavs offense has been a dumpster fire all year and he's putting up good numbers efficiently. Sexton is one of those players that people don't like out of the draft, for very fair and obvious reasons, and it takes a while for the perception of him to change. But if he isn't over an 80, than I really don't know what we're doing here with the rating system. We have had Andrew Wiggins as 80+ ever since I've been on here and he's been pretty awful that whole time (this is his first season even sniffing league average TS%) just based on pre-draft perception. There's no way in hell he'd be above 78 if he was drafted 15th overall. If Sexton isn't above an 80, we should all just admit we've never seen a Cavs game and say that we're still working off of what DraftExpress said about him in 2018. This isn't a shot at Walt Frazier or anything like that. Just speaking more towards the various overall ratings number and not the mechanics that go into ratings and how that effects the game. I think those are two separate conversations as we've seen with players like Giannis who should be a 97 or so, but that rating translates to like 15 points per game for whatever reason. No hard feelings here. Just, do not yell at me when his fg, 3pt, inside, steal,OAware are all in the 90s... (Only half kidding)
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Post by Walt Frazier on Feb 19, 2021 2:19:13 GMT
THREAD CLOSED
Raise to an 81
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