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Post by Jared Montini on Jun 8, 2018 13:02:15 GMT
Utah trades:
Markelle Fultz $5,855,200 $6,949,900 $8,121,000 $10,240,581 $13,312,755
8th Overall 2018 Draft Pick
2019 Okc 1st
Phoenix trades:
4th Overall 2018 Draft Pick
29th Overall 2018 Draft Pick
Milos Teodosic $3,000,000 $3,000,000 $3,000,000
Henry Ellenson $1,314,400 $1,371,000 $2,114,082 $3,029,480
2020 Hornets 1st
Atlanta 2019 2nd
2021 Phx 2nd
19 Portland 2nd
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Elton Brand
Former Jazz GM
Sophomore
Posts: 258 
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Post by Elton Brand on Jun 8, 2018 19:28:44 GMT
I accept. I get a top 5 pick in the 2018 draft, which is one of the greatest draft classes of all time. I get the 29th overall pick, which could be a gem in a trade as stacked as this one. I also receive Milos Teodosic, who looks like he could be a most improved player next season. Henry Ellenson has also shown some potential to be a decent NBA player throughout this season, specifically towards the end of this season. In addition, I get an assortment of future picks, which could allow me to get more promising players on this team.
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Post by Tom Izzo on Jun 8, 2018 19:59:29 GMT
Fultz and the eighth is simply too much for the fourth overall pick. Your desire to rid yourself of him astounds me. Idk if it's a result of this sub over the year trashing him and decreasing his value or what. Steal for Phoenix still. Good job Montini
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Post by Jared Montini on Jun 8, 2018 21:28:47 GMT
Fultz and the eighth is simply too much for the fourth overall pick. Your desire to rid yourself of him astounds me. Idk if it's a result of this sub over the year trashing him and decreasing his value or what. Steal for Phoenix still. Good job Montini Thanks man, I was actually kind of hesitant to do this deal. Fultz is one of my favorite players at the moment and he has a chance to be something really special. However he may not pan out because of injury and then I'd be screwed. At 4 in this draft you can get Jackson Bagley or bamba which I think Bagley and Bamba have super star potential. |
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Post by Tom Izzo on Jun 8, 2018 21:36:11 GMT
This is a steal man. Fultz is going to come back fine from his injury. IMO, this trade is heavily lopsided still.
You're going to get Fultz and still have a top ten pick. You won this trade easily
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Post by Jared Montini on Jun 8, 2018 21:38:16 GMT
This is a steal man. Fultz is going to come back fine from his injury. IMO, this trade is heavily lopsided still. You're going to get Fultz and still have a top ten pick. You won this trade easily time will tell, I hope so. Just upset that I can't draft bamba now |
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Post by Alex English on Jun 8, 2018 21:41:21 GMT
Again, I reject. This is barely different from the last one. Just some stuff thrown in as extras that doesn't change what this trade is about. I accept. I get a top 5 pick in the 2018 draft, which is one of the greatest draft classes of all time. I get the 29th overall pick, which could be a gem in a trade as stacked as this one. Also, this kind of statement is a red flag for me. 2012 was a stacked draft class, looking back now though, outside of Davis and Lillard, there is a lot of mediocrity. 2014 was stacked too, the hype over Wiggins, Parker and Embiid was crazy, not to mention Exum, Randle, Smart, etc. That was the most hyped draft class since 2003. Right now though it looks totally average. Wiggins and Parker are solid, but they're not superstars. Embiid is the only one that appears to be able to reach his potential, but he can barely stay on the court so far. So how do you know 2018 will actually be great? If I can quote Moneyball for a second: So whoever it is that you desperately want with that #4 pick, you don't know if he's going to pan out or not. Not only that, you really don't know if the guy you want at #4 will actually be better than the guy you'd take at #8. For me, the guy I'd take at 4, will probably also be available at 8. So I'm not convinced for a second that the difference between those two spots is so large that you need to give up Markelle Fultz. You've been sucked into the draft hype. Every year people go on about all these rookies that will be amazing, and it never turns out that way. How many guys do you have in your head that you think could be star players in this draft? If that number is any higher than 5-10, then you're out of your mind. That gem you think you can get with the 29th pick is probably terrible. There are never more than a handful of players in any draft that become must-have players. Most are mediocre starters at best, but more likely just role players that are completely interchangeable with a hundred other guys in the NBA that could perform at pretty much the same level. D5 has been going on so long that there are some clear patterns when new GMs sign up. So many think free agency is going to be a cakewalk, they'll just sign all these stars and be on their way. Bada boom, bada bing, you're the champion of the league. Eay as pie. Except not so much... Then you have tons of guys who think they're draft guru psychics that can see the future. That's kind of what I think is going on here. If you stick around long enough, you'll see both that most of your draft picks will go nowhere, and that player development can take some time. This time last year half of D5 thought Brandon Ingram was a bust, and he was healthy all year. Fultz has been injured, and even then finished the season showing some good things in his last 10 games. It's just foolish to throw him away at the value you're getting for him with this trade. I'm probably coming across a little condescending in this post but Elton Brand if you're confused or frustrated with with the hard time you're getting with all you're moves, then understanding what I've said in this post should help, even if you disagree with it. |
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Jun 9, 2018 0:45:26 GMT
If you're gonna dump Fultz then this is a good deal for it.
I say if anyone posts a real offer for Fultz here that is better than what Phoenix is giving then post it. If we all agree it's a better deal then reject this one and do that one. If this trade was last year (D5) he would get Jayson Tatum and Juwan Evans with the 4th and 29th pick. I say let em do it.
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Post by Jay Z on Jun 9, 2018 1:53:55 GMT
I've liked the trade from the Sun's perspective both times, but of course this one seems a lot more even.
What I don't understand is whats the rush to pull the trigger right now with so many question marks? Trading Fultz at this juncture seems rash, but I understand that you're sold on a player(s) and you have to give up something to get something.
My main issue is why not wait until the IRL NBA draft takes place? Since we of course have no power in how a player develops, we're at the mercy of the actual team that does draft said player and that can change a players stock in an instant. God knows I wish I knew what a shit show IRL Orlando was going to be because they were a directionless team and I wasted two lotto picks with them.
Or take it a step further and wait until the D5 4th pick is up so you know exactly who that 4th pick will be instead of hoping things go the way you want. Making this decision right now just limits the amount of information you have, and unless Jared tells you it's now or never, waiting would be in your best interest. And I say this even if you have 5 players right now that you'd be willing to take with the 4th pick, being more informed can't harm you in this situation.
Not trying to shit on this trade or anything like that, and I hope none of this came off that way, Fultz has some very real red flags that has distorted his value. Just trying to stress the importance of patience at this point in the off-season.
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Post by Hanamichi Sakuragi on Jun 9, 2018 7:04:26 GMT
And Utah wins the deal.
And the TCs will again overvalue Fultz and undervalue the package.
I second Memphis, if you want to use Fultz value as a reason, please give us a trade package from your team that you are willing to give for Fultz. Let us see if it can match what is currently on the table.
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Jun 9, 2018 11:41:20 GMT
I will give you Davis Bertans and the 26th pick for Fultz and then immediately try and trade him for the 8th pick straight up.
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Larry Bird
 Indiana Pacers
Starter
Posts: 1,672
Mar 5, 2024 13:29:26 GMT
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Post by Larry Bird on Jun 9, 2018 12:07:03 GMT
I’ll give you Isaiah Thomas, the #36, Golden States 2nd this year, and Milwaukee’s 2nd next year for Fultz.
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Post by Andrei Kirilenko on Jun 9, 2018 12:07:20 GMT
I'd give you Sabonis or Bam for Fultz. If you PM me we might be able to work something out around #7 for Fultz.
I guess part of my frustration with this trade is that I'm legitimately willing to give you more (IMO) for Fultz but every time I PM you, you either don't respond or just say "no thanks". I'm clearly interested, so why are you not seeing how much I will negotiate? Instead, you are insistent on trading Fultz to a GM who is telling you he isn't worth anything.
Jared literally told me in a PM yesterday that he thinks "Fultz can be an allstar" and is insistent on including Booker in a deal. Obviously I'm not going to include Booker, but that shows you how much value Jared actually thinks he has. You're including him as filler yet Jared is trying to flip him for Devin freaking Booker.
You have last year's #1 overall pick who has been injured his entire first year... and you are valuing him as just a supplementary piece to move up from #8 to #4 in a draft where everyone is pretty much the same after the top 2. Just like Alex said, thats a death sentence in D5. You took over a rebuilding team, and you are trying to move your assets before they get any value. It's exactly what Orlando does in real life year after year. WHy are you insistent on selling low?
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Post by Walt Frazier on Jun 9, 2018 12:15:33 GMT
I'm in the same boat as Alex. The main pieces in this deal aren't really any different than the one that got rejected, my reasoning isn't changing because of some 2nd rounders, etc. There's an argument to be made that Fultz for 4 is bad value for Fultz. I'm not making the argument myself right now, but you could make that argument and, long-term, have a good chance at being proven correct.
Reject
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Billy King
Former Jazz and Knicks GM
Rookie
Posts: 248
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Post by Billy King on Jun 9, 2018 14:12:18 GMT
Did someone say there is an opening by the Great Salt Lake?
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Elton Brand
Former Jazz GM
Sophomore
Posts: 258
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Post by Elton Brand on Jun 9, 2018 14:34:27 GMT
I'd give you Sabonis or Bam for Fultz. If you PM me we might be able to work something out around #7 for Fultz. I guess part of my frustration with this trade is that I'm legitimately willing to give you more (IMO) for Fultz but every time I PM you, you either don't respond or just say "no thanks". I'm clearly interested, so why are you not seeing how much I will negotiate? Instead, you are insistent on trading Fultz to a GM who is telling you he isn't worth anything. Jared literally told me in a PM yesterday that he thinks "Fultz can be an allstar" and is insistent on including Booker in a deal. Obviously I'm not going to include Booker, but that shows you how much value Jared actually thinks he has. You're including him as filler yet Jared is trying to flip him for Devin freaking Booker. You have last year's #1 overall pick who has been injured his entire first year... and you are valuing him as just a supplementary piece to move up from #8 to #4 in a draft where everyone is pretty much the same after the top 2. Just like Alex said, thats a death sentence in D5. You took over a rebuilding team, and you are trying to move your assets before they get any value. It's exactly what Orlando does in real life year after year. WHy are you insistent on selling low? I apologize for not being able to be more specific in your messages, I was focusing on this deal. |
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Post by Jared Montini on Jun 9, 2018 14:54:06 GMT
Damn guess it's most likely gonna get rejected again. Pick 4 is itb
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Amare Stoudemire
 Sacramento Kings
Starter
Posts: 2,416
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Post by Amare Stoudemire on Jun 9, 2018 14:59:30 GMT
Why dont u just make this easy
Fultz
Okc 1st 19
For
Picks 4, 29 2018
Tele
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Post by Jared Montini on Jun 9, 2018 15:02:43 GMT
Why dont u just make this easy Fultz Okc 1st 19 For Picks 4, 29 2018 Tele cuz I wouldn't do that trade for 500000 dollars |
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Amare Stoudemire
Sacramento Kings
Starter
Posts: 2,416
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Post by Amare Stoudemire on Jun 9, 2018 15:12:28 GMT
Maybe thats the problem! U think it should cost fultz to move up 4 spots in what will almost surely be a disappointing draft bc they usually all are! Your crazy! 19 year old #1 overall, believe he had a triple double against the bucks end of the year and really just needs the summer to get his groove back, and is still going to be really good lmao
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Post by Walt Frazier on Jun 9, 2018 15:36:53 GMT
Why dont u just make this easy Fultz Okc 1st 19 For Picks 4, 29 2018 Tele cuz I wouldn't do that trade for 500000 dollars You crazy man. Gimme 5000 and I'll make any trade you want, legit. |
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Post by Walt Frazier on Jun 9, 2018 15:37:59 GMT
I'll trade teams with anyone (Detroit, anyone) for even 5000, let alone 5 HUNDRED thousand?! Lol
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Jun 9, 2018 15:47:16 GMT
I'll trade teams with anyone (Detroit, anyone) for even 5000, let alone 5 HUNDRED thousand?! Lol COLLUSION!!! |
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Post by Jared Montini on Jun 9, 2018 23:00:06 GMT
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Post by Hanamichi Sakuragi on Jun 10, 2018 0:02:55 GMT
I really cannot believe this.. added another 1st and quality 2nd rounders and still a no...
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Post by Jared Montini on Jun 10, 2018 0:06:21 GMT
I really cannot believe this.. added another 1st and quality 2nd rounders and still a no... it's crazy man I know |
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Post by Alex English on Jun 10, 2018 0:16:12 GMT
I really cannot believe this.. added another 1st and quality 2nd rounders and still a no... Utah is also giving up another 1st... |
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Post by Jared Montini on Jun 10, 2018 1:00:51 GMT
I really cannot believe this.. added another 1st and quality 2nd rounders and still a no... Utah is also giving up another 1st... do you not value Ellenson or teodosic at all? |
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Jun 10, 2018 1:29:53 GMT
Utah is also giving up another 1st... do you not value Ellenson or teodosic at all? I don't. |
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Amare Stoudemire
Sacramento Kings
Starter
Posts: 2,416
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Post by Amare Stoudemire on Jun 10, 2018 2:27:22 GMT
This trade is not good fultz is way more valuable! I got taken out of the running for this gm position for being over zealous and i got a better deal for fultz and his value was at a all time low than! Cmon guys
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