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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Mar 8, 2017 7:48:01 GMT
Current Rating: 79 Suggested Rating: 89
This rating probably won't be able to get through till next season but I think he's established the caliber of player he is so far and will start out next season with full minutes.
12th in Total Offensive Rebounds 18th in Total Rebounds 6th in Field Goal Percentage 5th in 2pt Field Goal Percentage 16th in Rebounds Per Game 10th in Player Efficiency Rating 4th in True Shooting Percentage 6th in Effective Field Goal Percentage 8th in Offensive Rebound Percentage 18th in Defensive Rebound Percentage 12th in Total Rebound Percentage 3rd in Offensive Rating 14th in Offensive Win Shares 19th in Win Shares 7th in Win Shares Per 40 Minutes 7th in Box Plus Minus 9th in Offensive Box Plus Minus 15th in Value Over Replacement Player
He's rated as PF on ESPN, he's literally so versatile if you could hide him on a bad 3 man you could.
1st in Field Goal Percentage for PF 3rd in Assists Per Game for PF 8th in Points Per Game for PF 4th in Rebounds Per Game for PF 14th in Blocks Per Game for PF 16th in Steals Per Game for PF 6th in Three Point Percentage for PF 4th in Double Doubles for PF 1st in Triple Doubles for PF
All of these rankings are based on Jokic playing 27 minutes per game due to their coach taking his time realizing who his best player is.
Stats/Per 36:
MPG: 27.1 / 36 PPG: 15.9 / 21.2 AST: 4.6 / 6.1 REB: 9.2 / 12.3 STL: .7 / 1.0 BLK: .8 / 1.1 FT%: 80.7 / 80.7 FG%: 58.1 / 58.1
Bigs he's beating in PER: Karl Towns 84 Blake Griffin 89
Bigs he's beating in FG% Hassan Whiteside 83 Enes Kanter 81 Andre Drummond 84 Karl Towns 84 (I told you it was too soon to boost him that high thanks for fuckin up my draft pick)
Beating every GSW starter in Effective FG% They are all 85+
Offensive Rebounding Percentage: Kevin Love 88
Total Rebounding Percentage: Anthony Davis 92 Demarcus Cousins 93
For clarification I am not saying that just because someone is rated a certain way they need to be lowered due to my comparisons. I'm merely trying to show what caliber player he is. He's not beating every big name in everything, but he's beating few big names in everything.
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Post by Ian Noble on Mar 8, 2017 9:18:48 GMT
89?! Steady now.
Obviously he's performing extremely well, but Wiggins is still only an 81. Embiid is 81. Jabari got bumped to 83 right before injury. KAT is 84.
89 is possible in the future but it's important to not get too carried away too quickly.
I vote 82
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Post by Alex English on Mar 8, 2017 9:51:01 GMT
All of these rankings are based on Jokic playing 27 minutes per game due to their coach taking his time realizing who his best player is. More likely it's because Jokic is a foul machine. Only 5 players in the entire league have played more minutes than Jokic with a greater rate of fouls per 36 minutes. Most of the games he gets so little playing time is a result of being in foul trouble. Jokic is a future star, I have no doubt, but 89 is crazy to me too. You can't get an 89 rating by averaging 16 and 9. I don't care about minutes, or efficiency, or anything. You're just not accomplishing enough with that production to be worth a boost to 89. I think an 82-83 rating is fair.
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Deleted
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May 7, 2024 19:38:01 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2017 12:39:24 GMT
Top 10 offensive player bottom 150 defensive players. I don't think he would be negative to a teams success though (like jabari) just because of how much he can get others involved on offense.
84
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Post by Walt Frazier on Mar 8, 2017 13:53:00 GMT
I'm generally in line with what Alex said above, but I maybe believe just a little bit more I guess in his across-the-board talents and contributions. 16 & 9 with his assists and ability to hit 3's, etc, makes a little more of a difference.
84
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Post by Ian Noble on Mar 8, 2017 13:55:49 GMT
I don't think he would be negative to a teams success though (like jabari) Hey what?! Bucks are 22W / 28L with Jabari this season Bucks are 7W / 5L without Not exactly conclusive.
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Deleted
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May 7, 2024 19:38:01 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2017 13:57:19 GMT
I don't think he would be negative to a teams success though (like jabari) Hey what?! Bucks are 22W / 28L with Jabari this season Bucks are 7W / 5L without Not exactly conclusive. Not to turn this into a jabari thread but if I was being more specific, like I've been in the past, I'd of said "against quality opponents". He can be a positive asset to a team in the regular season, especially in the East, but he is exploitable by a good team and most all Star level power forwards are bad matchups for him. Of course I'm just projecting, results have yet to say anything. So sad we probably won't ever know for sure.
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Mar 8, 2017 19:43:54 GMT
89?! Steady now. Obviously he's performing extremely well, but Wiggins is still only an 81. Embiid is 81. Jabari got bumped to 83 right before injury. KAT is 84. 89 is possible in the future but it's important to not get too carried away too quickly. I vote 82 KAT's real life team compared to Jokic's real life team. I'd bet the Wolves have a higher D5 OVR than Jokic. Jokic is the best player on a playoff team. KAT is the best player on a lotto team. Also just an aside, Tom Thibodeau should be fired, he is a bad coach in this era. He's still so averse to that newfangled 3 point line.
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Mar 8, 2017 19:55:43 GMT
10th in Player Efficiency Rating
4th in True Shooting Percentage
6th in Effective Field Goal Percentage
8th in Offensive Rebound Percentage
18th in Defensive Rebound Percentage
12th in Total Rebound Percentage
3rd in Offensive Rating
We can't properly rate him at an 82. He's got too much going for him. He fouls a bit but I mean, lower his DAware a bit. Do you know how many categories that he beats Durant in that I found while researching this bit?
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Post by James Kay on Mar 8, 2017 20:19:07 GMT
10th in Player Efficiency Rating Do you know how many categories that he beats Durant in that I found while researching this bit? When advanced stats go too far...
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Mar 8, 2017 20:33:26 GMT
10th in Player Efficiency Rating Do you know how many categories that he beats Durant in that I found while researching this bit? When advanced stats go too far... He's not beating him in PER, but in FG% and stuff like that. It's just like this dude is better than a lot of Power Forwards is all I'm trying to point out.
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Post by Jared Montini on Mar 9, 2017 3:38:36 GMT
87, he has been on a tear this season. He is the best passing big man I've ever seen and I see him keeping up this pace for awhile. I know voting him so high is kinda premature but I think I've seen enough. The reason he needs to be rated so high is because he's such a versatile player. His passing rating should be pretty high and he just needs a lot of points to show how much of an all around player he is.
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Kevin Hollis
Former Thunder GM for 7 years
All Star
Posts: 2,838
Dec 16, 2022 11:27:40 GMT
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Post by Kevin Hollis on Mar 9, 2017 4:12:19 GMT
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Mar 9, 2017 5:25:26 GMT
Right now this is what I'm looking at for ratings and a comparison player rating who he compares with in real life.
O Aware: 85 (Pau Gasol) FG: 85 (Basically above average for good players in D5) 3PT: 67 (Kristaaps Porzingis) FT: 81 (LaMarcus Alderidge, almost exact actually lol) Inside: 90 (Less than Gobert, he beats LBJ, Durant in 2pt FG%) Dunk: 85 (As far as I know this stat just helps inside FG% so I put it around the other inside guys) Pass: 74 (Between Draymond and Marc Gasol in terms of big man passing) Handle: 68 (Pau, he's better than Pau but all the other comparible bigs had weird handle numbers) D Aware: 67 (Mirotic, I used him because he kind of sucks on defense) Steal: 45 (Marcus Morris) Block: 45 (He's a little better than Markief Morris) O Reb: 85 (Kenneth Faried) D Reb: 80 (Draymond Green's Defensive Rebounding lines up well with Jokic) Speed: 65 (For Physicals I sort of just copied Jon Leuer with a little more strength because their the same height an average, I gave Jokic a bit more strength because he operates in the post better and weighs like 25 more lbs more) Quick: 67 Jump: 52 Strong: 82 Fatigue: 73
What OVR does that equal?
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Post by Walt Frazier on Mar 9, 2017 6:41:24 GMT
What OVR does that equal? I think it would fall somewhere in the 87-91 range. It's a bit inexact and whenever I build players from scratch it tends to come out screwy. But, somewhere up there.
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Post by Brandon Roy on Mar 21, 2017 8:50:29 GMT
83 for a start
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Post by Charles Barkley on Mar 21, 2017 14:06:10 GMT
82, we've taken it slow in the past, should take it slow in the present
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Post by Hanamichi Sakuragi on Mar 25, 2017 3:09:41 GMT
He is very very versatile. His play this season deserves around 90?
You can be conservative all you want but too much will be a disservice to the player. And in reality, what is the point of being conservative to younger players when you judge the veterans and at peak players with their current performance?
I will go 86.
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Post by Brian Scalabrine on Mar 25, 2017 3:24:49 GMT
87 everything but defense is elite
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Mar 27, 2017 5:43:21 GMT
He is very very versatile. His play this season deserves around 90? You can be conservative all you want but too much will be a disservice to the player. And in reality, what is the point of being conservative to younger players when you judge the veterans and at peak players with their current performance? I will go 86. There is something to be said for being a little patient but its why I waited almost all season to put in my raise thread. He's good and its not just some fluke so really I don't understand why everyone is so conservative on him especially knowing that for a big he needs a few more extra points for his sweet passing and he's a decent dribbler as well.
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Post by Walt Frazier on Apr 2, 2017 2:44:22 GMT
Guess I'll go 84.5
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Nov 10, 2017 3:44:04 GMT
Bumping this thread, Ian Noble can you close the other Jokic thread please so there is no confusion.
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Post by Ian Noble on Nov 10, 2017 13:28:32 GMT
Bumping this thread, Ian Noble can you close the other Jokic thread please so there is no confusion. So... is this thread the newest? Should it be moved to Stock Watch? Should the other thread in Stock Watch be moved to archives?
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Deleted
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May 7, 2024 19:38:01 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2017 16:13:09 GMT
Same vote, same reason. Until this guy is able to protect the rim he's hit his ceiling.
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Nov 10, 2017 17:54:59 GMT
Bumping this thread, Ian Noble can you close the other Jokic thread please so there is no confusion. So... is this thread the newest? Should it be moved to Stock Watch? Should the other thread in Stock Watch be moved to archives? That seems to be what Walt meant unless these votes have already been tallied.
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Nov 10, 2017 17:58:15 GMT
Same vote, same reason. Until this guy is able to protect the rim he's hit his ceiling. Idk he's more versatile than K Love and he peaked at an 88. I think Jokic is actually better at defense than Love is too.
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Deleted
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May 7, 2024 19:38:01 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2017 18:03:10 GMT
Same vote, same reason. Until this guy is able to protect the rim he's hit his ceiling. Idk he's more versatile than K Love and he peaked at an 88. I think Jokic is actually better at defense than Love is too. Yeah, I never voted Klove an 88
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Post by Ian Noble on Nov 10, 2017 18:37:49 GMT
moved
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Post by Jared Montini on Nov 10, 2017 20:27:50 GMT
87
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Post by Walt Frazier on Nov 10, 2017 23:37:03 GMT
Jokic has been updated. We don't need either of these threads to be active.
If you want him higher than he got from this thread, last year, make a new thread, por favor
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