2013 Prospects

[Kevin Ware]

Jun 18, 2013 17:54:33 GMT Ian Noble said:

I can't believe the Cavs are thinking of taking Alex Len #1. He's alright, but he's like a worse version of Jonas Valanciunas. At least Nerlens Noel will be a defensive presence, Alex Len will need to do a LOT of work to be a force on either end.



He's done ok in College because he's tall and quite agile but that's not going to save him in the Pros. He's got good hands and can rebound quite nicely, but he can't butter toast with his left and gets totally shutdown when defended. He makes offensive ugly moves like Wilt Chamberlain did in the 60s, when Wilt was able to rely on his uber height which Len will not be able to do. The scouts say he has a lot of potential but I just don't see it, and I also see a lack of heart, he's like Bargnani but without the offensive skill set and more injury prone.

I'm going to say this now because I'm guaranteed a late 1st rounder: Ben McLemore is the best player in the draft. If I'm the Cavs, I trade Waiters for a big man and have an Irving/McLemore backcourt.

Sorry Ian you're doing a great job running this league but I want to punch you for saying that. I'm so tired of every non cavs fan assuming McLemore is superior to Waiters. McLemore is a below average ball handler and lacks focus. He can shoot and is athletic but will struggle to score in the NBA. Waiters has proven to have elite all-around offensive ability and just needs to improve defensively. As a Cavs fan I would be very disappointed if we traded Waiters, who has shown he can be successful in the NBA, for another SG who still has a lot of questions surrounding him. I know the Cavs don't get a lot of media attention so aside from Kyrie most of you have not seen our other guys play. I'm hoping the Cavs pick between Porter, Noel, and Len.

[Alex English]

Jun 19, 2013 3:13:41 GMT Kevin Ware said:

Sorry Ian you're doing a great job running this league but I want to punch you for saying that. I'm so tired of every non cavs fan assuming McLemore is superior to Waiters. McLemore is a below average ball handler and lacks focus. He can shoot and is athletic but will struggle to score in the NBA. Waiters has proven to have elite all-around offensive ability and just needs to improve defensively. As a Cavs fan I would be very disappointed if we traded Waiters, who has shown he can be successful in the NBA, for another SG who still has a lot of questions surrounding him. I know the Cavs don't get a lot of media attention so aside from Kyrie most of you have not seen our other guys play. I'm hoping the Cavs pick between Porter, Noel, and Len.

Waiters isn't that good. He averaged 14.7ppg but only shot 41% from the field and 31% from three. He also only averaged 3 assists and 2.4 rebounds per game so he doesn't exactly contribute in other ways. McLemore looks like a much more efficient player. He nearly had a 50-40-90 season shooting 49.5% from the field, 42% from three and 87% from the line. He also averaged 5.2 rebounds per game so unlike Waiters it looks like he'll contribute in other ways besides scoring. Not that Waiters is awful but I'd be surprised if McLemore doesn't turn out to be the better player.

[Kevin Ware]

Waiters was out of shape at the beginning of the year but improved greatly towards the end. He made all rookie 1st team for a reason. I understand you're looking at stats but I'm looking at all 61 games I watched him play.

[Blake Bowman]

I gotta agree with K-Ware, Waiters is a good player. It's only his rookie year, so he's got a good bit of time to improve. I wouldn't move him to get McLemore.

[Deleted]

Jun 19, 2013 3:13:41 GMT Kevin Ware said:

Jun 18, 2013 17:54:33 GMT Ian Noble said:

I can't believe the Cavs are thinking of taking Alex Len #1. He's alright, but he's like a worse version of Jonas Valanciunas. At least Nerlens Noel will be a defensive presence, Alex Len will need to do a LOT of work to be a force on either end.



He's done ok in College because he's tall and quite agile but that's not going to save him in the Pros. He's got good hands and can rebound quite nicely, but he can't butter toast with his left and gets totally shutdown when defended. He makes offensive ugly moves like Wilt Chamberlain did in the 60s, when Wilt was able to rely on his uber height which Len will not be able to do. The scouts say he has a lot of potential but I just don't see it, and I also see a lack of heart, he's like Bargnani but without the offensive skill set and more injury prone.

I'm going to say this now because I'm guaranteed a late 1st rounder: Ben McLemore is the best player in the draft. If I'm the Cavs, I trade Waiters for a big man and have an Irving/McLemore backcourt.

Sorry Ian you're doing a great job running this league but I want to punch you for saying that. I'm so tired of every non cavs fan assuming McLemore is superior to Waiters. McLemore is a below average ball handler and lacks focus. He can shoot and is athletic but will struggle to score in the NBA. Waiters has proven to have elite all-around offensive ability and just needs to improve defensively. As a Cavs fan I would be very disappointed if we traded Waiters, who has shown he can be successful in the NBA, for another SG who still has a lot of questions surrounding him. I know the Cavs don't get a lot of media attention so aside from Kyrie most of you have not seen our other guys play. I'm hoping the Cavs pick between Porter, Noel, and Len.

I do not watch a lot of college basketball, so when I draft for the league, last year I picked at #2 and #3, I watch a ton of youtube videos on the players within that range. While I like Waiters game and think he will be a good pro, a causal glance at him versus a Ben McLemore, who I heard people on TV talking about so I thought I would check him out, does not compare. McLemore, to me, looks like a super athletic Ray Allen and really could be great. I understand a lack of focus can be a bad thing, but you cannot coach the thing his skill set. I probably should not say this, but if I win the draft lottery I will take McLemore #1 and would GLADLY trade Waiters, who I do like and owned in this league for most of the year, for McLemore.

[Deleted]

Jun 19, 2013 3:13:41 GMT Kevin Ware said:

Jun 18, 2013 17:54:33 GMT Ian Noble said:

I can't believe the Cavs are thinking of taking Alex Len #1. He's alright, but he's like a worse version of Jonas Valanciunas. At least Nerlens Noel will be a defensive presence, Alex Len will need to do a LOT of work to be a force on either end.



He's done ok in College because he's tall and quite agile but that's not going to save him in the Pros. He's got good hands and can rebound quite nicely, but he can't butter toast with his left and gets totally shutdown when defended. He makes offensive ugly moves like Wilt Chamberlain did in the 60s, when Wilt was able to rely on his uber height which Len will not be able to do. The scouts say he has a lot of potential but I just don't see it, and I also see a lack of heart, he's like Bargnani but without the offensive skill set and more injury prone.

I'm going to say this now because I'm guaranteed a late 1st rounder: Ben McLemore is the best player in the draft. If I'm the Cavs, I trade Waiters for a big man and have an Irving/McLemore backcourt.

Sorry Ian you're doing a great job running this league but I want to punch you for saying that. I'm so tired of every non cavs fan assuming McLemore is superior to Waiters. McLemore is a below average ball handler and lacks focus. He can shoot and is athletic but will struggle to score in the NBA. Waiters has proven to have elite all-around offensive ability and just needs to improve defensively. As a Cavs fan I would be very disappointed if we traded Waiters, who has shown he can be successful in the NBA, for another SG who still has a lot of questions surrounding him. I know the Cavs don't get a lot of media attention so aside from Kyrie most of you have not seen our other guys play. I'm hoping the Cavs pick between Porter, Noel, and Len.

I do not watch a lot of college basketball, so when I draft for the league, last year I picked at #2 and #3, I watch a ton of youtube videos on the players within that range. While I like Waiters game and think he will be a good pro, a causal glance at him versus a Ben McLemore, who I heard people on TV talking about so I thought I would check him out, does not compare. McLemore, to me, looks like a super athletic Ray Allen and really could be great. I understand a lack of focus can be a bad thing, but you cannot coach the thing he does. I probably should not say this, but if I win the draft lottery I will take McLemore #1 and would GLADLY trade Waiters, who I do like and owned in this league for most of the year, for McLemore.

[Magic Johnson]

people grossly overrated Waiters, he is a high volume chucker who isn't really a great defender, not a great passer, not a great all around player, just knows how to score.

I'd easily get rid of Waiters for McLemore and others.

they made a huge mistake passing up Barnes/Drummond/Lillard for Waiters.

[Kevin Ware]

Jun 19, 2013 5:09:27 GMT Vlade Divac said:

Jun 19, 2013 3:13:41 GMT Kevin Ware said:

Sorry Ian you're doing a great job running this league but I want to punch you for saying that. I'm so tired of every non cavs fan assuming McLemore is superior to Waiters. McLemore is a below average ball handler and lacks focus. He can shoot and is athletic but will struggle to score in the NBA. Waiters has proven to have elite all-around offensive ability and just needs to improve defensively. As a Cavs fan I would be very disappointed if we traded Waiters, who has shown he can be successful in the NBA, for another SG who still has a lot of questions surrounding him. I know the Cavs don't get a lot of media attention so aside from Kyrie most of you have not seen our other guys play. I'm hoping the Cavs pick between Porter, Noel, and Len.

I do not watch a lot of college basketball, so when I draft for the league, last year I picked at #2 and #3, I watch a ton of youtube videos on the players within that range. While I like Waiters game and think he will be a good pro, a causal glance at him versus a Ben McLemore, who I heard people on TV talking about so I thought I would check him out, does not compare. McLemore, to me, looks like a super athletic Ray Allen and really could be great. I understand a lack of focus can be a bad thing, but you cannot coach the thing he does. I probably should not say this, but if I win the draft lottery I will take McLemore #1 and would GLADLY trade Waiters, who I do like and owned in this league for most of the year, for McLemore.

If I get a pick ahead of you and McLemore is the best available in my opinion. I will trade him to you for Waiters straight up.

[Kevin Ware]

Jun 19, 2013 5:35:04 GMT Magic Johnson said:

people grossly overrated Waiters, he is a high volume chucker who isn't really a great defender, not a great passer, not a great all around player, just knows how to score.

I'd easily get rid of Waiters for McLemore and others.

they made a huge mistake passing up Barnes/Drummond/Lillard for Waiters.

Who overrates him? I've never seen anyone other than Cavs fans talk positively about him. Waiters is primarily a scorer but is also an above average passer and point guard making him a great combo guard. His assists are low because Kyrie and Varejao were out half the year and no one else on the team could score consistently.

[Deleted]

Jun 19, 2013 5:42:01 GMT Kevin Ware said:

Jun 19, 2013 5:09:27 GMT Vlade Divac said:

I do not watch a lot of college basketball, so when I draft for the league, last year I picked at #2 and #3, I watch a ton of youtube videos on the players within that range. While I like Waiters game and think he will be a good pro, a causal glance at him versus a Ben McLemore, who I heard people on TV talking about so I thought I would check him out, does not compare. McLemore, to me, looks like a super athletic Ray Allen and really could be great. I understand a lack of focus can be a bad thing, but you cannot coach the thing he does. I probably should not say this, but if I win the draft lottery I will take McLemore #1 and would GLADLY trade Waiters, who I do like and owned in this league for most of the year, for McLemore.

If I get a pick ahead of you and McLemore is the best available in my opinion. I will trade him to you for Waiters straight up.

I would do that if I still owned Waiters, but maybe Philly would want to do that?

[Ian Noble]

These convos will be interesting to return to in a few years I just hope I don't look like an idiot in them, which is entirely possible, haha.

[Glenn Robinson]

I like McLemore's potential over Waiters potential.

[Alex English]

Jun 19, 2013 7:35:16 GMT Ian Noble said:

These convos will be interesting to return to in a few years I just hope I don't look like an idiot in them, which is entirely possible, haha.

You won't on this one at least, lol. Waiters is very average. He's a one dimensional volume shooter. There are a lot of things he needs to add to his game just to be a quality starter let alone anything better.

[Kevin Ware]

Jun 19, 2013 16:56:26 GMT Alex English said:

Jun 19, 2013 7:35:16 GMT Ian Noble said:

These convos will be interesting to return to in a few years I just hope I don't look like an idiot in them, which is entirely possible, haha.

You won't on this one at least, lol. Waiters is very average. He's a one dimensional volume shooter. There are a lot of things he needs to add to his game just to be a quality starter let alone anything better.

I know you like to argue with people but I guarantee you I have watched a lot more of Waiters than you have so I find it comical that you act like you are so sure you know what you are talking about.

We'll see how McLemore and Waiters develop over the next few years though and I will be sure to bring this up again when Waiters ends up being a really good player.

[Ian Noble]

Looking at McLemore again. He's like a worse-version of DWade and Ray Allen combined. I see him being borderline All Star at least.

Iffy decision making at times, especially on defence, but quite fearless in taking contact and driving the lane. Very good as a spot up shooter. Very good passer and thinker on offence.

Anyway I'll stop now

[Deleted]

Jun 19, 2013 12:42:38 GMT Glenn Robinson said:

I like McLemore's potential over Waiters potential.

I concur 100% and this totally summarizes my argument.

[Alex English]

Jun 19, 2013 17:33:21 GMT Kevin Ware said:

I know you like to argue with people

No I don't!

[Ian Noble]

lol this reminds me of the Monty Python sketch:

[Glenn Robinson]

Jun 19, 2013 20:05:02 GMT Ian Noble said:

lol this reminds me of the Monty Python sketch:

Oh you Brits and your witty humor.

[Kevin Ware]

Jun 19, 2013 18:59:06 GMT Vlade Divac said:

Jun 19, 2013 12:42:38 GMT Glenn Robinson said:

I like McLemore's potential over Waiters potential.

I concur 100% and this totally summarizes my argument.

Whatever, I still like Waiters better .

[Kevin Ware]

www.cbssports.com/nba/blog/eye-on-basketball/22466502/report-ben-mclemore-slipping-because-of-workout-issues

[Ian Noble]

So far, Anthony Bennett would go in my Top 3 along with Nerlens Noel and Ben McLemore.

Damn this is a weak draft

NBA.com have Otto Porter at #3 on their mock draft. I see his ceiling being Tayshaun Prince, which is certainly no slouch, he's one of the most underrated guys in the league his whole career, but he's not going to make or break a dynasty. I only see McLemore as being a player who could significantly alter a team's destiny, with Noel as a shorter version of Dikembe Mutombo or something.

[Ian Noble]

There are a few players with the athleticism and size to pan out into All Stars, but they are always gambles anyway (e.g. Shabazz).

Shabazz could be a James Harden type guy, but equally he could be Ronnie Brewer.

[Alex English]

It's like there is no top 5 this year. McLemore and Noel maybe but that's even hard to say since he's been out for so long. Then there are guys like Bennett, Porter, Len, Burke and Oladipo who are good, but for like the 5-15 range. There is no top end this year, but I don't think it's a shallow draft though. There should still be some decent talent available in the late 1st round.

[Kevin Ware]

Yeah, regardless of what anyone says it is definitely a weak draft in terms of potential stars... I'm about 60% sure the Cavs are taking Noel at this point.

[Ian Noble]

Jun 24, 2013 21:01:21 GMT Ian Noble said:

So far, Anthony Bennett would go in my Top 3 along with Nerlens Noel and Ben McLemore.

Ok so I didn't call Bennett going #1, but I am high on him and I still think these three guys should be the Top 3.

... with Trey Burke at 4! He's like a less-impressive version of Allen Iverson, which still means you've got yourself a floor general for 15 years.

[Otis Smith]

I personally love victor oladipo and alex len

my two favourite prospects

[Glenn Robinson]

Jul 10, 2013 20:01:43 GMT Otis Smith said:

I personally love victor oladipo and alex len

my two favourite prospects

An Oladipo/Holiday back court could be lethal.

[Walt Frazier]

Jul 10, 2013 20:01:43 GMT Otis Smith said:

I personally love victor oladipo and alex len

my two favourite prospects

IMO this is trying to drive up the price on that 1st pick, but whatever, nothing wrong with that :-)

[Ian Noble]

So... McLemore at #2.

Since submitting the Garnett/Pierce trade I've endlessly watched videos and I know who I'm picking at #5 already. The problem with this draft is that, even at #2 there's not one player who's going to be a certified safe bet.

I think the most stable pick would be Otto Porter, but there's no point taking Tayshaun Prince the Second with a #2 pick, you've got to pick the guy who could be an All Star/franchise player, and that's why I (aka. Cleveland) picked McLemore.

After watching all that video my main concern with McLemore is that he's not confident. He's a great glue-guy, clearly works wonders in the locker room and things, but he doesn't have the mentality of an All Star yet, and I do have serious worries about whether the Sacramento Kings system can instil that in him.

McLemore comes from a tough background and has even been arrested, which doesn't bode well when he's teaming up with Demarcus Cousins's attitude to the game. Cousins can make-do because he's a big-man, but McLemore doesn't have that luxury.

McLemore has the physical tools, the skill, but it's the mentality that's going to decide whether he's a roleplayer or a superstar. He'll get some run above Marcus Thornton in the Kings rotation though, at least I hope he does! But I hope Sacramento can bring out a killer instinct and stop him from being another Tyreke Evans.