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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Jun 19, 2017 18:09:45 GMT
or way better... Unfortunately, he is still with the Kings.. The king's make shitty teams, but they certainly don't hinder centers development. They hinder everyone's development.
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Post by Ian Noble on Jun 19, 2017 18:11:35 GMT
The king's make shitty teams, but they certainly don't hinder centers development. They hinder everyone's development. Couldn't agree with this more. Buddy Hield will get the star treatment maybe, like Boogie did, and put up all those empty stats from now on. edit: additionally - De'aaron Fox is going to Sacramento because he's the only guy who says he wants to go there. Last year the Kings totally ballsed up their draft because nobody wanted to work out with them, that's how bad they are for player development.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2017 18:12:33 GMT
The king's make shitty teams, but they certainly don't hinder centers development. They hinder everyone's development. Yeah cousins would totally be better now if he wasn't on the king's /Sarcasm
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Jun 19, 2017 18:21:20 GMT
They hinder everyone's development. Yeah cousins would totally be better now if he wasn't on the king's /Sarcasm I truly believe if he had started his career out with a Brad Stevens or Rick Carlisle he would have been much better off. In fact the Kings are so inept at running a franchise they fired the only coach that got them to a winning record with Boogie in the middle of the damned season because Cousins goes down with a staph infection. WHAT!!!!
If you think that a player develops the same in that environment as any other environment then I think you are incorrect.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2017 18:35:22 GMT
Yeah cousins would totally be better now if he wasn't on the king's /Sarcasm I truly believe if he had started his career out with a Brad Stevens or Rick Carlisle he would have been much better off. In fact the Kings are so inept at running a franchise they fired the only coach that got them to a winning record with Boogie in the middle of the damned season because Cousins goes down with a staph infection. WHAT!!!!
If you think that a player develops the same in that environment as any other environment then I think you are incorrect. I agree the king's are dysfunctional, but I think that if vlade knows one thing it is probably fostering an environment to develop centers. I really like the progress all of their prospects have shown at that position. From DMC to WCS to Skal, and even papagiannis looked good by the end of the year even though he was only just turning 20.
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Post by Hanamichi Sakuragi on Jun 19, 2017 23:24:08 GMT
Papagianis could be better than a peak B. Lopez. 'nough said.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2017 0:07:15 GMT
Papagianis could be better than a peak B. Lopez. 'nough said. Definitely. I try to project my players around their 70-80% ceiling though. He could be a Marc gasol if he keeps improving.
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Post by Brian Scalabrine on Jun 20, 2017 2:00:50 GMT
Papagianis could be better than a peak B. Lopez. 'nough said. Definitely. I try to project my players around their 70-80% ceiling though. He could be a Marc gasol if he keeps improving. I personally seen him as more of a Hakeem Olajuwan type
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2017 2:01:48 GMT
Definitely. I try to project my players around their 70-80% ceiling though. He could be a Marc gasol if he keeps improving. I personally seen him as more of a Hakeem Olajuwan type I'll take it.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2017 2:04:33 GMT
Papagiannis has stretch to him though, he's gonna be shooting 3s when he gets consistent playing time and isn't in a "dont fuck this up" type of role.
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Post by Ian Noble on Jun 20, 2017 8:11:00 GMT
With Danny Ainge and the Celtics unanimously trading down because they didn't think Fultz was #1 - does that hurt Fultz's draft stock? Any second thoughts @riogho? With Tatum set to go 3rd what does that mean for Josh Jackson's draft stock?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2017 11:47:09 GMT
With Danny Ainge and the Celtics unanimously trading down because they didn't think Fultz was #1 - does that hurt Fultz's draft stock? Any second thoughts @riogho? With Tatum set to go 3rd what does that mean for Josh Jackson's draft stock? For every seller there is a buyer.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2017 12:03:26 GMT
On the part of Tatum I am excited... Tatum looks like the guy I'm gonna get at 4, and him going to Boston over Phoenix is great news imo.
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Post by Ian Noble on Jun 20, 2017 19:59:39 GMT
On the part of Tatum I am excited... Tatum looks like the guy I'm gonna get at 4, and him going to Boston over Phoenix is great news imo. Boston liking (presumably) Jayson Tatum that much definitely now has me a bit flummoxed at #3. I've seen a Reddit thread that says the Celtics think he's their next Paul Pierce, and although that's kinda stupid I do believe Tatum to have the best mindset of the top picks, which is what I thought of Jaylen Brown last year and he definitely didn't disappoint. He doesn't have the athleticism of Josh Jackson but he's not far behind and he grew up in posher private schools with posher private ambitions, for whatever that's worth - ie. he's not just thrilled to be in the NBA, he wants to dominate the NBA.
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Jun 20, 2017 21:54:36 GMT
On the part of Tatum I am excited... Tatum looks like the guy I'm gonna get at 4, and him going to Boston over Phoenix is great news imo. Boston liking (presumably) Jayson Tatum that much definitely now has me a bit flummoxed at #3. I've seen a Reddit thread that says the Celtics think he's their next Paul Pierce, and although that's kinda stupid I do believe Tatum to have the best mindset of the top picks, which is what I thought of Jaylen Brown last year and he definitely didn't disappoint. He doesn't have the athleticism of Josh Jackson but he's not far behind and he grew up in posher private schools with posher private ambitions, for whatever that's worth - ie. he's not just thrilled to be in the NBA, he wants to dominate the NBA. I wouldn't call Jaylen Brown someone who didn't disappoint. For a top 3 pick to come in and merely be not a complete disaster is hardly a success story to me. He's got something to build on but if they take one of these wings with their pick then Brown is gonna be the odd man out. Maybe if your at 3 here, you just do whatever Boston does and count on Brad Stevens to figure out your wing situation for you. (honestly not the worst idea imo). Draft Express has been a complete and utter joke the past few seasons in figuring out talent. Heck, even figuring out where people will go half the time. There is growing sentiment that Boston will be taking Isaac (he was the first player they brought in for workouts and is refusing to workout for anyone past pick 4) and if we're being honest a mobile 6'11" guy with wing skills might be just what they need to push themselves over the top.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2017 22:15:03 GMT
Boston liking (presumably) Jayson Tatum that much definitely now has me a bit flummoxed at #3. I've seen a Reddit thread that says the Celtics think he's their next Paul Pierce, and although that's kinda stupid I do believe Tatum to have the best mindset of the top picks, which is what I thought of Jaylen Brown last year and he definitely didn't disappoint. He doesn't have the athleticism of Josh Jackson but he's not far behind and he grew up in posher private schools with posher private ambitions, for whatever that's worth - ie. he's not just thrilled to be in the NBA, he wants to dominate the NBA. I wouldn't call Jaylen Brown someone who didn't disappoint. For a top 3 pick to come in and merely be not a complete disaster is hardly a success story to me. He's got something to build on but if they take one of these wings with their pick then Brown is gonna be the odd man out. Maybe if your at 3 here, you just do whatever Boston does and count on Brad Stevens to figure out your wing situation for you. (honestly not the worst idea imo). Draft Express has been a complete and utter joke the past few seasons in figuring out talent. Heck, even figuring out where people will go half the time. There is growing sentiment that Boston will be taking Isaac (he was the first player they brought in for workouts and is refusing to workout for anyone past pick 4) and if we're being honest a mobile 6'11" guy with wing skills might be just what they need to push themselves over the top. Anyone who takes Isaac that high is fucking nuts.
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Jun 21, 2017 0:45:26 GMT
I wouldn't call Jaylen Brown someone who didn't disappoint. For a top 3 pick to come in and merely be not a complete disaster is hardly a success story to me. He's got something to build on but if they take one of these wings with their pick then Brown is gonna be the odd man out. Maybe if your at 3 here, you just do whatever Boston does and count on Brad Stevens to figure out your wing situation for you. (honestly not the worst idea imo). Draft Express has been a complete and utter joke the past few seasons in figuring out talent. Heck, even figuring out where people will go half the time. There is growing sentiment that Boston will be taking Isaac (he was the first player they brought in for workouts and is refusing to workout for anyone past pick 4) and if we're being honest a mobile 6'11" guy with wing skills might be just what they need to push themselves over the top. Anyone who takes Isaac that high is fucking nuts. He's got as much upside as anyone in this draft just purely based on his profile. He just needs a bit of an attitude adjustment. What does Boston need? Rim protection. You can't just march out Tyler Zellers slow ass so you get a 6'11" wing to play that mobile Draymond Green role.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2017 0:49:16 GMT
Anyone who takes Isaac that high is fucking nuts. He's got as much upside as anyone in this draft just purely based on his profile. He just needs a bit of an attitude adjustment. What does Boston need? Rim protection. You can't just march out Tyler Zellers slow ass so you get a 6'11" wing to play that mobile Draymond Green role. Except he can't facilitate, and he's incredibly limited as a scorer. If his shot doesn't translate he's gonna bust hard.
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Jun 21, 2017 1:23:13 GMT
He's got as much upside as anyone in this draft just purely based on his profile. He just needs a bit of an attitude adjustment. What does Boston need? Rim protection. You can't just march out Tyler Zellers slow ass so you get a 6'11" wing to play that mobile Draymond Green role. Except he can't facilitate, and he's incredibly limited as a scorer. If his shot doesn't translate he's gonna bust hard. Saying if someone's shot doesn't translate they'll bust is stupid. No crap, if ANY prospects shot doesn't translate they're a bust. Jackson and Tatum both have their own form issues (Tatum less so). So to make that a talking point is kind of silly. Strengths of Isaac in terms of playing on Boston. 31% of his shots came from spot ups, on those spot ups he shot 43% overall. His biggest problem with iso scoring is a lack of balance which affects his release consistency. But he's a 6'11" 19 year old. Anyone familiar with particularly balanced big men coming into the league because they aren't common. His defense is straight up baller and he can play small ball 5. That's literally the exact player you want. If he can develop a bit in the ISO, finishing through contact (strength issue) and as a ball mover then he's gonna be an awesome player. His only defensive flaws are strength and a bit of over helping. I imagine a decent workout program and Brad Stevens will solve these issues respectively. Actually the more I talk about it I think that the Isaac pick is a slam dunk for Boston.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2017 1:28:45 GMT
Except he can't facilitate, and he's incredibly limited as a scorer. If his shot doesn't translate he's gonna bust hard. Saying if someone's shot doesn't translate they'll bust is stupid. No crap, if ANY prospects shot doesn't translate they're a bust. Jackson and Tatum both have their own form issues (Tatum less so). So to make that a talking point is kind of silly. Strengths of Isaac in terms of playing on Boston. 31% of his shots came from spot ups, on those spot ups he shot 43% overall. His biggest problem with iso scoring is a lack of balance which affects his release consistency. But he's a 6'11" 19 year old. Anyone familiar with particularly balanced big men coming into the league because they aren't common. His defense is straight up baller and he can play small ball 5. That's literally the exact player you want. If he can develop a bit in the ISO, finishing through contact (strength issue) and as a ball mover then he's gonna be an awesome player. His only defensive flaws are strength and a bit of over helping. I imagine a decent workout program and Brad Stevens will solve these issues respectively. Actually the more I talk about it I think that the Isaac pick is a slam dunk for Boston. No dude, that's the whole point. If Josh Jackson's shot doesn't translate he'll still be a really really good player. If Isaac's shot doesn't translate he's a shitty role player that can come in and get a couple blocks maybe.
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Post by Brian Scalabrine on Jun 21, 2017 1:30:16 GMT
The thing is Jeremiah, the Celtics already have bunch of good wings who can shoot the ball well and are role players. Isaac would add something for sure but they need more shot creation which is why I think Tatum will be the pick at #3
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Jun 21, 2017 1:36:48 GMT
The thing is Jeremiah, the Celtics already have bunch of good wings who can shoot the ball well and are role players. Isaac would add something for sure but they need more shot creation which is why I think Tatum will be the pick at #3 They need rim protection and rebounding.
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Jun 21, 2017 1:38:13 GMT
Saying if someone's shot doesn't translate they'll bust is stupid. No crap, if ANY prospects shot doesn't translate they're a bust. Jackson and Tatum both have their own form issues (Tatum less so). So to make that a talking point is kind of silly. Strengths of Isaac in terms of playing on Boston. 31% of his shots came from spot ups, on those spot ups he shot 43% overall. His biggest problem with iso scoring is a lack of balance which affects his release consistency. But he's a 6'11" 19 year old. Anyone familiar with particularly balanced big men coming into the league because they aren't common. His defense is straight up baller and he can play small ball 5. That's literally the exact player you want. If he can develop a bit in the ISO, finishing through contact (strength issue) and as a ball mover then he's gonna be an awesome player. His only defensive flaws are strength and a bit of over helping. I imagine a decent workout program and Brad Stevens will solve these issues respectively. Actually the more I talk about it I think that the Isaac pick is a slam dunk for Boston. No dude, that's the whole point. If Josh Jackson's shot doesn't translate he'll still be a really really good player. If Isaac's shot doesn't translate he's a shitty role player that can come in and get a couple blocks maybe. If Josh Jackson's shot doesn't translate he'll be a black hole on offense in the same way that Michael Kidd-Gilchrist is. He might be playable. Playable and good are two different things in my opinion.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2017 1:39:11 GMT
No dude, that's the whole point. If Josh Jackson's shot doesn't translate he'll still be a really really good player. If Isaac's shot doesn't translate he's a shitty role player that can come in and get a couple blocks maybe. If Josh Jackson's shot doesn't translate he'll be a black hole on offense in the same way that Michael Kidd-Gilchrist is. He might be playable. Playable and good are two different things in my opinion. ... what youre comparing isaac to fucking draymond green and then you call josh jackson a black hole on offense? do you even watch ncaa?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2017 1:41:02 GMT
Like I don't even know what to say to that, Jeremiah. It's like you have their names backward.
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Post by Jeremiah Hill on Jun 21, 2017 1:47:11 GMT
If Josh Jackson's shot doesn't translate he'll be a black hole on offense in the same way that Michael Kidd-Gilchrist is. He might be playable. Playable and good are two different things in my opinion. ... what youre comparing isaac to fucking draymond green and then you call josh jackson a black hole on offense?do you even watch ncaa?
... What do those two things even have to do with one another. Is that a Trump tweet?
I compared the role of being a spot up shooter and mobile defender you can switch onto people to a guy who does that, yes. Draymond is a better passer but the role is similar. If Draymond couldn't hit a spot up jumper he would be a smaller Tristan Thompson with passing.
Josh Jackson is undersized to play as a rim protector so he's useless there. Can't spread the floor (which you need from a small ball 5). He'll be decent-good on defense but if he's still shooting 50% from the foul line he'll be freaking useless.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2017 1:54:49 GMT
... what youre comparing isaac to fucking draymond green and then you call josh jackson a black hole on offense?do you even watch ncaa?
... What do those two things even have to do with one another. Is that a Trump tweet?
I compared the role of being a spot up shooter and mobile defender you can switch onto people to a guy who does that, yes. Draymond is a better passer but the role is similar. If Draymond couldn't hit a spot up jumper he would be a smaller Tristan Thompson with passing.
Josh Jackson is undersized to play as a rim protector so he's useless there. Can't spread the floor (which you need from a small ball 5). He'll be decent-good on defense but if he's still shooting 50% from the foul line he'll be freaking useless. First of all, "black hole on offense" means that the ball isn't gonna leave his hands after he gets it. That comes from not being able to pass, which is a huge problem that Isaac has. If his shot doesn't translate he will be an intense offensive liability his entire career. Second, you talk about how JJ is undersized and can't be a rim protector as a small ball five, but he is taller and has the same wingspan as Draymond green. He is also one of the best facilitators at the wing in the draft in years (if you ignore BS), and calling his defense "decent-good" is fucking insane. JJ made more 3 pointers than Isaac this season, and on less shots. Literally his only weakness is his FT%, which you mentioned, but I honestly don't understand what the fuck you are talking about otherwise. Sure his shot could not translate, but he can do literally everything else on offense, and everything on defense. My guess is you didn't watch Kansas at all.
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Post by Charles Barkley on Jun 21, 2017 2:37:42 GMT
Justin > Josh
Josh Hart > Lonzo Ball
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Post by Jared Montini on Jun 21, 2017 2:57:55 GMT
josh hart is malcolm brogdon 2.0.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2017 3:01:40 GMT
Stop fucking mentioning Josh Hart you fucking cunts
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